General Chat

In the last 47 years the basic wage, say for a Builder's Labourer, has gone up by 2000%. In the last 37 years house prices have increased by 3000%. Am I the only one who still considers our Politicians to be a bunch of Self-Serving W***ers who have no interest in improving the lives of the people they are elected to represent?

As far as I can see the politicians in this this country (including NI) can't see any further than their own noses & cannot comprehend the fact that the ordinary person out there could be struggling financially. I don't think it would matter if it was a Conservative OR a Labour government in power - neither one reverses the other's policies!! Ails x

Too True Grampa Jim, What have they done to our country? I'm young and I can't afford my own house, and never will be able to. The more you work, the more they take off you anyway. I would emmigrate to Canada or somewhere like that if I could. Our Country is well beyond spoilt now. No future, nothing but being worse off.

I think when politicians first come in, they really do want to change things, and believe in their policies, but as they go on, they fall in with the rest......that is why there is not so much difference between the parties........I remember when the Conservatives were trying to privatise the hospitals.....and now they are all for the health service.....short memories, or what.... I have no trust anymore in politicians......they spend money on what serves them best....blow the rest of us.....

The job of MP is unskilled: you need no qualifications other than the gift of the gab. Theoretically you can be Chancellor of the Exchequer without even GCSE Maths. Politics and social engineering is the driver, not economics. The House of Lords has far more expertise than the House of Commons, which is one reason why they want to get rid of it.

I totally agree with you, Jim. Nomatter how 'democratic' politicians try to tell us this country is, there is vast hidden corruption. Who owned the company that set up the useless NHS computer programme? Tony Balir's tennis partner. Who made most profit when the railways were sold off? Shareholders, Who owned a lot of shares? Politicians & their friends, hence we, the public are still paying for this. Railtrack have finally decided they need more carriages. Who's paying for them? The government ie you and I. Why? The goverment seems totally unaware of the number of people in serious debt - they blame people for 'living above their means'. Many people just can't survive on their pay, House prices constantly rise, people have to rent, rents rise etc. My council rent has risen by £5 a week, not a lot you say, but that's £250 a year, then the council tax, then the utility bills. All in all I have to find an extra £500 a year. My cost of living rise at work will be £250. I earn far below the 'average', but am above minimum wage standard. Don't drive, or my outgoings would be even more. Bus & train fares are bound to go up. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see the lower paid are being fleeced, and the better paid are raking it in. the government just doesn't seem to care. How have banks got away with overcharing people for so long? What's the government doing about utility companies attempting to charge people who don't pay by Direct debit? As for Brown so generously upping the amount of compensation for workers whose pension funds closed - well the firm should pay. All Brown is doing is taking from one hand and giving it to the other. By we, the public funding this extra money, all this means is the pensioners will not receive as much Tax credit - also paid for by us. How did so many firms get away with basically stealing pension funds??? *I'll get off me soapbox now* Maggie (If this lubby government is socialist I'm a communist)

'How did so many firms get away with basically stealing pension funds???' They didn't steal them. What happened was that pension funds were benefitting from a good rate of return in the 1990's and the Government told them that they had to reduce contributions to avoid overfunding, else they would fine them for tax avoidance. So firms reduced their conributions. Gordon Brown jumped on the bandwagon and withdrew the £5 billion tax per annum relief on dividend income that pension funds had been receiving. Shortly afterwards investment returns fell (as they tend to do, these things run in cycles), The statutory rules on how you calculate the required funding level were changed from 'Minimum Funding Requirement' to a more onerous buy-out calculation which required firms to put in more money. The Chancellor kept his £5 billion per annum (plus inflation). So schemes went from being overfunded to underfunded and had to abandon final salary provisions to avoid bankrupcy.

Well I feel sorry for the old people of this country, those who fought in the wars, they fought for this country and the Government thank them by giving them a pittance to live on. The Jobs are all going abroad, there is nothing here anymore, no safe jobs. Child poverty here is getting worse, never mind giving every other country other than our own any help financially, they need to sort out their own shores first. Goverments mean nothing to the normal people, they feed the fat cat's first and only look out for themselves, as long as they have their pay packet that's ok.

Gramps, you have hit the nail on the head. I was born in the east end with parents, grand parents etc. who were hard working ordinary men and women. One of the things that background taught me was.....If you don`t have the money you can`t have it, ie...save for it. When I returned to work after my children were old enough to be left, I paid into the company pension scheme, and also paid enhanced pension contributions. It was very hard to do, but I did look 25 years down the road. It is now that I should be enjoying the benifits that I could have had 25 years ago !!!!! Am I, no, no, no. Just to live in this house, which still has a mortgage even though I am retired, means being very careful as I have to pay, mortgage...insurances...council tax...gas...elect....water...phone, and my luxury, the computer., and I hav`nt eaten yet or put clothes on my back. The doctors is 3 miles away, (country lane with no footpath). I do have my bus pass, but with only one bus an hour my trip to the doctors could take 3 hours, and that is if the surgery is on time. I think I am right in saying 95% of members of parliament come from 'comfortable' backgrounds!!!!!! Kathlyn

Thanks for that Brian :o) So basically the government set up provision for the fund, then reduced/withdrew the funding thereby causing the schemes to fold and, until pre- budget pressure, didn't give much of a damn. Now we have to pay more because of Brown's previous action. maggie

Have to admit I'm not in a pension scheme, and I won't get any of my ex's either (part of the divorce settlement). I moved around with my ex's job, gettiing generally low-paid jobs where I could. Then took 4 years out to have my children and started low paid work again - to fit around them. Got divorced. Carried on in low paid work to fit around the children. Couldn;t afford a pension because I needed every penny to survive. Went to Uni in the hope of improving my prospects - made litle difference, there are people with degrees applying for lower paid jobs than mine!! Children are now grown up. I was in full time employment for 3 years with the council, then made redundant (more like constructive dismissal) when the office moved to the middle of nowhere!! Spent 3 years temping and looking for another 'proper' job. Been where I am now (back with the council - lower grade & pay) for 18months. I am over 50, not on an excellent wage. Whatever I pay into the 'final salary' - which is now 'half final salary' - pension scheme won't actually give me much, as you have had to pay into it for 12 years without a break to get the full amount. As I've been made redundant once, who's to say it won't happen again? It would be S*ds law that I'd be paying money in, only to find at the end of it all that I was just over the limit for extra help!! It sounds negative - I suppose it is, but 8% off your wages when you're not earning a lot is a big chunk. I'd rather have the money now than end up with an extra pittance later. maggie

I also cannot understand how so many Government Contracts run so long overtime and cost so much over Budget. In the real world Contractors are financially penalised if they over-run. I am also at a loss as to how the Portsmouth Stick, that great symbol of our link with the sea, cost so much and ran so long over, (and, by the way, the scenic lift STILL isn't working 7 and a quarter years after the due date) when St Paul's Cathedral was built for £750,000, within budget and on time in the 17th century by manual labour BEFORE we had Powered Cranes and all the technical advances we 'enjoy'.

The one thing we 'ordinary' people have is...Life skills...you know, making £1 go as far as £1.10p......Just let members of parliament, and their wives and children, live for a month or two in a council house, oopppsss sorry, they are now called Social Housing...do I hear a rose by any other name !!!...with the income that family have. Let them manage on the pittance our pensioners have....and these are the pensioners who either fought in or grew up during the war, and have never been well off. THEN we might see some changes.....Oh dear...do I hear another saying...A leopard etc. etc. Kathlyn

Jim,Maggie & others l have'nt read all of this thread but l get the jist of it and totally agree with you - AND I (sadly) voted for Labour. l'm easily confused by (anything really lol) politics, but do feel we have been badly let down- but so did the Conservatives.They really need to get out into the real world and do as they expect us to do!!! l'll not vote again:o((( jude sarf wales

Jim, the reason that Goverment Contracts always overrun is because they never put 'Penalty Clauses' in them because the Quangoes have to be taken care of and then there is the 'Well paid Directorships 'to be handed out to the 'Favoured few' the money has to come from somewhere,and thats the poor old Taxpayer as per.Just look at the way all the MPs.are running around showing their alliegence to Gordon Brown,not because they like him, but because they want lucarative jobs,I suppose it could be called 'Original Brown Nosing' Hal.

They do say that we have a Free Market Economy, I prefer it to be called an Uncontrolled Greed Economy. Jude, maybe the whole Country should be encouraged to vote for Independent Candidates and then perhaps the 650 of them can put their heads together to SOLVE the problems we have instead of just posturing and scoring points off the other side, and voting against good ideas just because the other side suggest them..

Jim - sounds like a good idea:o)) jude sarf wales :o)

One of the first acts passed by D Day Morgan and his band of Welsh Assembly cronies was to vote themselves a hefty pension increase... I did hear on an MP on the radio recently telling nurses that he had not had a pay rise last year....failing to mention the £ 10,000 tax free increase in already over generous and unaccountable expenses.. that he had recieved

Colin, Why should he have a pay increase? Politicians are overpaid anyway. A guaranteed big wedge for 4 years regardless of whether they can do the job or not, no Targets to achieve and a nice little Pension and probably a lucrative Directorship or two at the end.

For the first time in my life I feel like NOT voting ever again. It doesn't matter who gets in..... we are their last thought. in one week, our outlay has gone up by £5 a week.....and those are the only two things we have noticed so far!! Not too necessary..... only gas and water. Deanna X