General Chat

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http://news.uk.msn.com/uk/work-for-your-dole-plan-wins-support
Maybe the question might as well have been… Should Jobseekers be forced to work as slaves?
Not content the politicians employing people like ATOS to grab benefits away from millions of genuine sick & disabled people at the cost of MILLIONS of POUNDS of our tax payers money, & then find some people can’t cope so they decide to commit suicide.

Not content that the politicians of this country have put so many people out of work. They want the unemployed, to work for the unemployment money they get from the system they have already paid into.

If this goes ahead it’s just one step away from slavery & taking away people’s rights. More people will lose jobs because why should an employer employ & pay a person to do a job when they can get the job done for free? Unemployment will go up & things will keep getting worse. Meanwhile politicians, bankers & other high wage earners will carry on getting richer.

This is just my view but I would like to see your view on this, & I do accept your view may not be the same as mine so we have no need to argue on here it’s just good to talk.

NOT EVEN MINIMUM WAGE ,ISNT THAT AGAINST THE LAW FOR EMPLOYERS,
SO ISNT THE GOVENMENT EMPLOYING THEM FOR NOTHING

I can think of nothing more hypocritical than a group of privileged millionaires sitting round the cabinet table discussing policies designed to penalise the young unemployed, whilst at one and the same time, turning a blind eye to companies and organisations exploiting, job schemes and zero hour contracts, to take on cheap labour or workers who they don't have to pay, so that they can ramp up their profits and for the government to claim that they have the best interests of those affected at the centre of what they are doing.

This does not just apply to policies for the young unemployed, it equally applies to all their other policies that affect the poor and vulnerable, policies, which in my opinion, they hope will lead to them achieving their ideological dream - which is to dismantle the welfare state.

You are on the right line Dizzi but the Job the unemployed will be doing will probably be a job that was once held by a good honest worker earning an honest wage to take care of his/her family, but would probably be unemployed because the unemployed person is doing the job he/she once did, as mad as that sounds.

So, the unemployed will pick up litter or cook meals for the elderly - are these seen by the tories as in the same 'ilk'?

Who will teach /pay for the unemployed to cook nutritious meals - or isn't that important?
Who will pay for CRB's? Or does it not really matter what sort of person deals with the elderly?

Not only does this show the contempt the tories have for the unemployed (all their own fault, apparently) it also shows just what they think of the elderly!!

Excellent point maggiewinchester.

Another thing that worries me is the unemployed people with children in school- who will provide & pay for their childcare after school & during school holidays or is this Govt going to bring about a large number of "latch key" kids by carrying out this idea?

I cannot see anything good coming out of this at all.

Then another aspect,,,

would it not hurt a young unemployed person who hasnt had a job for 2/3 years work one hour a week to cut an elderly housebound person grass or clean their windows,sweep elderly peoples paths clean of snow.?


how many times have people wrote on here how unfair that some on the dole seem to have more than working people who cant afford the latest gadgets or run cars.have the lastest designer clothes.,,,swan about town centers all day and dont want to work and should be made to something for their tax-payers handouts.....

If there are jobs for the Unemployed to do enabling them to get unemployment benifit,there is a Vacancy which should be filled ,there are to many things which are being done on a Volenteer, basis which at one time were genuine Full time jobs.

MERLIN
TRUE.......IF THERES A JOB FOR THE UNEMPLOYED
WHY WEREN'T THEY GIVEN THE CHANCE OF IT IN
THE FIRST PLACE..OR IS IT CHEAP LABOUR I'D SAY ZERO
WAGE IS MORE THAN CHEAP.
OR ARE THEY NON EXISTANT JOBS CREATED
TO FORFILL GOVENMENT EMBARRASMENT

On Benefits and Proud ..Monday 9pm ch 5

Am sure this programme will cause a lot of discussion.

Emma

What evidence is there that "the politicians of this country have put so many people out of work."

I lost my job with a major high street bank after 37 years service because I was deemed surplus to requirements. There wasn't a politician in sight.

Over the years I worked I paid more into the system that most on benefits ever will, but that isn't the way things work. The fact you paid in 'entitles' you to a big fat zero, and that applies to everyone.

Because I was stupid enough to buy my own house, for which I am still paying, incidentally, I don't qualify for a single penny of state relief. Worse still I have to pay tax on my pension, which is less than many are receiving in benefits, many of which are - quite wrongly in my opinion - tax free.

I would love to be able to get a few pounds dole money for a few hours work, but it isn't to be.

I'm with you on that one IGP, the government has not put people out of work. What successive governments have done however is to make it reasonably comfortable for the out of work to live on benefits encouraging some but not all to adopt it as a lifestyle. It is that situation the current government is trying to change.

I am not saying that everyone who is in receipt of benefits is work shy, obviously not but undoubtedly there are some who are. There are also some who use their benefits to "Top up" what they earn in the black economy. It is those whose lifestyles fall into those categories that the latest measures announced are designed to disrupt the most. Difficult to hold down a cash in the hand job in your local shop/pub/garage if the Jobcentre can call on you at short notice to attend a course. Life changing if now you have to do work of some kind every week in order to receive your benefits instead of only having to sign on at the JC once a fortnight.

The basic problem in the UK is too many people and too few jobs and no government "Tinkering" with benefit payments is likely to solve that but it would be nice to think that those getting the benefits are those genuinely entitled to them rather than those just taking the rest of us for a ride.

Well put Jonesey .....


have to agree

Merlin I agree with what you said. Some jobs that once where employed jobs are now used as voluntary jobs & should not be.

With respect, I can see why some may think as they do, with TV programs being aired with titles like On Benefits and Proud, that give a one sided view of things, maybe they should make a follow up called On Benefits and not through choice. Makes me wonder how many of those same people you mean where unemployed & have good understanding as to what it’s like in the real world of unemployment as it’s not all gadgets, cars & designer clothes for everybody, some people out there find it very, very hard indeed. I can’t see any good in this work for your benefit or how it will solve any of the unemployment problems we have in the UK.

I agree BK, just thought I'd mention the programme as
these sort of head lines draw the attention and not of those
who struggle every day.
No disrespect intended.

Emma

To often politicians and others join the one sided view that brands all young people and others on benefits as either cheating the system or being layabouts and scroungers - which is totally untrue.

I do not see that sort of publicity directed at those earning good salaries, those being David Cameron's - hard working people, some of whom abuse the Child Benefit & Tax System.

The genuine long term unemployed job seeker would probably welcome a few days a week out of the house to do something constructive, but not a full working week when it means they can't spend time looking for a job.

Having to get up and out at a reasonable hour could give the unemployed life-style 'job seeker' a wake up call. It would also give the unemployed young a taste for the discipline required when they do eventually get a paying job. ~They'd also have the opportunity to expand their 'net work' which could in turn lead to a recommendation for employment from one of their ex jobseeker colleaques.

Its always easier to find a job when you are in a job, even if that means so called voluntary work.

Can I just put a slightly different angle.

This is a world-wide recession and each country is dealing with it in the way they decide is most appropriate.

We have lost several companies due to this recession, some international, e:g Woolworth which would have provided the full- time jobs once the world economy picked up.

While it is no way ideal, the fact that some companies are managing to rub along using zero hours contracts and those who are being subsidised to keep themselves going must be a better prospect for the future than to have lost the companies that will provide future employment.

I can see the angle you are coming from Sharron, problem is that a lot of companies are using zero hour contracts and work schemes to boost what are already substantial profits.

I was in a local branch of a major supermarket chain the other week and could not get to the shelves in one aisle, because there was a group of about half a dozen young lads, stacking the shelves that I wanted access to.

I asked the guy that seemed to be supervising them what they were all doing, he told me they were on work experience - well when I looked at the profits that supermarket chain made last year - I don't think they need to be using cheap/free labour.

Are the supermarkets exploiting the system? Did they need those shelf stackers or are they making their resources available to train retail staff for the future?

Those lads would have been learning nothing of any future use to them had they been hanging about, doing whatever they do when they are out.