General Chat

At the age of 16 you can apply for a provisional licence which after a CBT enables you to ride up to a 50cc "moped " at the age of 17 its a 125 cc on the road , If you do not take your test after 2 years you have to re test your CBT .. if you pass your test you are alledgedly restricted to a 33 BHP , for 1 year although the law is loose on this and rarely applied .
At 17 you can take your car test , if you pass , as long as you can afford the insurance , you can drive anything , taking 4 passengers or more with you ..
I think that for the first year after passing a car test a similar restriction should be applied , also that for 1 year no more than 1 passenger should be allowed ..
Kim

I think all motorists should take a test every 5 years to keep them out of bad habits while driving. Any fines, points etc are deducted from the test results. That way, bad drivers (and I see some who leave me wondering how they ever passed their driving test) will be kept off the roads should they fail their test.

I agree,
as an advanced motorcyclist, and ex instructor, the motorcyclist has always been encouraged to become better road users, and rightfully so.
I think that car drivers should undergo the same example........
cmd

My biggest puzzle are people who drive at about 40mph down a 60mph road when there isn't another car to be seen on the horizon. They always seem to be around during the early afternoon, and usually on roads that are too winding to overtake them on.

Maybe they don't like going fast?

I agree Tw .. CMD what worries me is the fact that at 17 if you pass your test and Daddy is rich and happy to insure you , you can drive what the hell you like , even if Daddy isn,t rich , you are still legally able to take at least a minimum of 3 passengers in your vehicle .
In my experiece as a motorcyclist, although we are taught to be very aware of other road users , car drivers are not so well instructed ..I really think that the laws governing new motorcyclists should be adapted to encompass new car drivers ...
Kim xx

Sometimes we have to show some patience,
I drive very differently when I have my mom on board for example, she is 80 and has a very nervous, and just recovered from life saving cancer operation,so although I dont go too slow, I do have to drive slower on motorways, and A roads, than I would normally,so there is always someone it annoys, and they drive on my bumper,

last year I transported my daughters three tier cake 12 miles down a very busy, then winding country lane.....I was 'pooping' myself incase I had to brake hard, and I know it wound a few other drivers up.
I did not cause a hazard, but other road users showed no respect, even though my car was decorated to the hilt with ribbons and flowers....

Not speaking for every other 17 yr old driver but my daughter passed her driving test at 17.We are not rich but bought and insured a Punto grande 1200 cc for her 18th birthday.She does not go mad and is aware of all other road users.She did ask for a scooter but we said no as to the same reason as what you are saying.Car drivers.My husband has had 2 motorbike accidents both not his fault but by older drivers. Annie

I have always been complimented on my driving, and I put it down to being a motorcyclist first.....
years ago they used to say that motorcyclist made better car drivers, when I used to instruct, I used to say, and I still do
''treat every other person on the road like an idiot, never take for granted that they can drive as good as yourself.'' .

Ahh well I,m a white van driver ... people who hesitate at roundabouts ,, start , stop , start ... are a nightmare .. people driving at 30mph in a 60 are dangerous... people who think they are driving a tank not a Clio when they have to pass between 2 parked cars ...ARGHHHH..
And people who have spent over 20 grand on their motor but don,t realise indicators where included ......
:))))))))))
Kim xx

I have very strong feelings about the cc of new driver's first cars.

I do believe they should be limited. We know of so many youngsters who have been killed here who had a high performance car of their own, had modified their own car or borrowed their parents car.

It has been heartbreaking when my children have lost youngsters they were at school with. How their own families cope I cannot imagine.

My son had an accident when road conditions were poor. No one else involved, he hit a low bridge.Whilst he was in casualty we asked the police officer who attended to speak with him and basically frighten the cr*p out of him, which he did. Having told son that he could be telling us that he had been killed really shook him up.

Sue x

I think that's a very good idea Newby Kim - but don't quite know how it would be monitored - unless it was literally from the start. i.e. a ''certain'' level of licence be issued on passing the test, which would have to be exchanged after 12 months for the next (final) licence........ the logistics and paperwork would, I reckon, make this a no-no..... and certainly we don't have enough police to do things like catching criminals, let alone checking on these inexperienced drivers.

But certainly something needs to be done.

Whilst we continue to use the sort of licence that get's hidden away in wallets/pockets etc. catching ''offenders'' will be difficult - so why not have something that has to be displayed on the front AND back windscreens? That way (barring fraudulent licences) all other road-users could see it at a glance.

Far better perhaps to make the practical Driving test much harder - some time on a Motorway in rush hour, a half hour on a Skid-pan and so on........ but the cost of getting a licence would probably be prohibitive, and there'd be moans and groans from youngsters who would say they couldn't afford it - and, as you say, the rich Daddy would pay up.

Dear Grannie,
I have drove motorcycles all my life......but even I have been knocked off....once... In Italy by a drunken driver who did a U-turn in front of me and hubby,,, (he was driving).
We have only just bought our kids a car each, but they are 22 and 25, it was to help them out after Uni. but they paid for their lessons themselves and it was a ex-police instructor who gave them lessons,
when they were young, I also taught them road signs, rules etc, so they had a slight advantage.
Having said that, I have sat beside them both, and I am amazed how they get intimidated by other young drivers.... trying to get them to challenge them....


ha ha When someone winds me up, I admit I act like a old maid and slow down... they just pass and go their way.........

You'd like it where I live, Kim.

New drivers -- no matter how old they are, btw -- are subject to a load of restrictions for the first two years.

For starters, zero alcohol, not the usual .08 limit.

There are restrictions to daylight hours, restrictions on the number of passengers ... I can't remember them all, but they're designed to keep young drivers' minds on the road, and off the road in situations where there are risks.

(Er, that's keep the young drivers off the road in risk situations ... not keep their minds off the road ...)

From what I've heard, they work. "Accidents" involving new young drivers are down.

I recommend it. Go lobby somebody!

Coal miners daughter,she gets the same abuse.My dad taught me to drive and told me about the idiots.Hopefully i have passed them onto my daughter.Her words are i want to arrive safley. Annie

Dear Newby Kim,
I agree, about people driving something they think is 10 times wider than it is...perhaps because us motorcyclists are more aware of the space between us and something else, I dont know..
Due to a bad hip and leg..and a back and neck I cannot twist roundlike I used to .caused by that drunken driver, I dont like to drive our estate car anymore, so my hubby brought me a suzuki Wagon, three years ago,as I can climb in and out easier,and admit I can park it easier..
even I say that cars and Motorcycles are to powerful for todays roads,,,.

As for training....
I have always thought that road awareness should be taught as early as possible.
my hubby brought me a push-bike 2 years ago, and I have only been out on it once,,,,, It scared me stupid!!
cmdx

Now that sounds sensible Kathryn .. I have been involved in some lobbying .. this one was close to home and affected one of my sons friends , car overloaded , young girl killed when he lost control on ice .... he comes out of prison this year after a 3 year sentence , he was 18 when he was convicted .Trouble is , I find that in the UK , government and common sense are never found in the same sentence ..Government and money can always be found hand in hand .. sorry if I offend by saying this ... well actually no ,I,m not ..
Kim xx
:))).

Dear Kathryn B,
How long have these restrictions been in force?. it would be interesting to now the before and after statistics.

Its a shame for the average law abiding person, and sensible driver, who seems to be paying the price in high insurance. and of course its nearly always the inncent who get hurt.
cmd x

CMD .. with youy all the way there ... I think everyone should have a few lessons on a motorbike before their car test .It would make them aware of how vunerable they are on the roads .Must add its not always the car drivers tho , have seen instances of motorcyclists actions on the road that have made me cringe ...
Kathryn , the before and after stats would be very interesting if you have them avaliable ....
Kim xx

Dear Newby,
my other saying...

Its not the motorbike that dangerous....
Its the 'jerk' on the throttle....

same for 'jerks' at the wheel too....
xx cmd

Here's the official lowdown on "graduated licences" in Ontario:

http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/dandv/driver/gradu/index.html

(there's also stuff there about graduated motorcycle licences)

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Class G1

New drivers of passenger vehicles learn to drive with six important conditions with a G1 licence. A new driver must hold a G1 licence for a minimum of 12 months before attempting the G1 road test. This time can be reduced to eight months if you successfully complete an approved driver education course. Drivers earn more privileges after passing their G1 road test.

As a G1 driver, you are required to:

· maintain a zero blood alcohol level while driving;

· be accompanied by a fully licensed driver, who has at least four years driving experience, and a blood alcohol level of less than .05 per cent, in case he/she needs to take over the wheel;

· ensure the accompanying driver is the only other person in the front seat;

· ensure the number of passengers in the vehicle is limited to the number of working seat belts;

· refrain from driving on Ontario's "400-series" highways or on high speed expressways such as the Queen Elizabeth Way, Don Valley Parkway, Gardiner Expressway, E.C. Row Expressway and the Conestoga Parkway;

· refrain from driving between midnight and 5:00 a.m.


Class G2

New drivers must hold a G2 licence for a minimum of 12 months before they can attempt the G2 road test. At this level, you have more privileges because of your driving experience. You may drive without an accompanying driver on all Ontario roads anytime. However, you are still required to:

· maintain a zero blood alcohol level while driving;

· ensure the number of passengers in the vehicle is limited to the number of working seat belts.

>>> Our Graduated Licensing System has been a resounding success in reducing death and injury among novice drivers. Ontario research shows that new teenage drivers are almost three times more likely to be involved in a fatal or serious collision when they are carrying teenage passengers. In fact, research shows the more teenage passengers, the higher the risk.


To further protect youth on our roads, effective September 1, 2005: the number of young passengers that teen G2 drivers can carry will be limited from midnight to 5 a.m. as follows:

· Initially, G2 drivers 19 or under can carry only one passenger aged 19 or under.

· After the first six months, and until the G2 driver earns a full G licence or turns 20, they can carry only three passengers aged 19 or under.

The passenger restrictions do not apply if the G2 driver is operating a motor vehicle after 5 a.m. and before midnight.

These restrictions will not apply if the G2 driver is accompanied by a full "G" licensed driver (with at least four years driving experience) in the front seat, or if the passengers are immediate family members.

Thirty-one jurisdictions in Canada and the U.S. have some form of teenage passenger restrictions in effect.