Find Ancestors

I gave you the birth for Annie 1910 on your OTHER thread.

Yes Catherine died 6th April 1960 age 84 she was from Foilaclug Cappawhite Ireland by died Weybridge Surrey which at the time was Philip Ryans sons residence, I agree so many Ryans in Tipperary with some Ryans marrying into other Ryan families. 1911 census has Annie 5 months old which makes sense with Annie as James mother. Philip second son probably named after father of James.

Confusion not only with names, I fear. Confusion with dates and punctuation, too.

"Philip , Catherine and James son came over to England to live in Surrey. "
I take it that means Philip who was born in 1912?
Therefore this is his death:

Deaths 1989 (>99%)
RYAN PHILIP 7MR1912 SURREY N W 17 664

"Catherine came over and died at her sons home in Surrey" - therefore I assume this is her death - is that correct, Ruth? :

Deaths Jun 1960 (>99%)
RYAN Catherine 84 Surrey N.W. 5g 630

If so, she was born c1876.
That would fit reasonably well with the claim of marrying c1910.

But she's obviously not the Catherine/Kate Dwyer who married a James Ryan in 1872. That couple are a red herring.

It doesn't help that all the names were so common in Tipperary.

The 1911 census on the other thread does appear to be the right family, at Foilaclug.

Therefore James was born c1862, with parents Philip (who died 1883) - and possibly Ann(ie) if the 1901 census is for the same family..

But we can't find his birth or his marriage, nor his parents' marriage.

So, how old was Catherine when she died - and when was that?

Sorry , yes confusion taking over with names. James and catherine dwyer correct. Have letters and rememberance cards with photos on . My sisters father in law was Michael joseph ryan and he married Elsie Spratt (still living ) in England. Philip , Catherine and james son came over to England to live in Surrey. Two months before death Catherine came over and died at her sons home in Surrey . Letters also show that Philip and Michaels sister Margaret came to England but as a nun Sister Mechtildes. . The family that remained in Ireland and there ancestors were unknown

As per the other thread, i couldn’t find a marriage for the parents of Michael Joseph……it really is a nuisance having two threads on here about this

They claimed in 1911 to have been married for one complete year.

Haven't checked to see if already posted on the other thread [EDIT: Yes, ErikaH posted it ]:


Marriage record for James Ryan and Catherine Dwyer
Party 1 Name: James Ryan
Party 2 Name: Catherine Dwyer
Date of Event: 31/01/1872
Group Registration ID: 2778362
SR District/Reg Area: Tipperary

James's father: Philip Ryan, deceased, farmer. >>>>>>>>>>>>>
Address: Kilcordan

Catherine signs as "Kate". <<<<<<<<<<<<<
Her father: Michael Dwyer, farmer


However, that Philip Ryan isn't the one from Foilaclug, who died in 1883.

And this couple named James and Kate are not the parents of children born in early 20th century.

The man who died in 1937 was said to be 75, suggesting birth c1862.

But who knows?!
He may have been lying to his family about his age!

However, Ruth is confused.
In this thread she says that Philip Ryan (1912) was her sister's father-in-law.
In her other thread she says Michael Joseph Ryan (1918) was her sister's father-in-law.

From familysearch.....................????????????

Name James Ryan
Father's Name Philip Ryan
Father's Sex Male
Mother's Name Anne Ryan
Mother's Sex Female
Event Type Baptism
Event Date 6 Jan 1853
Event Place Kilcommon, County Tipperary, Ireland

If this is the man who died in 1937, the census info posted on the OTHER thread may be a different man. I posted what I found for Ruth's evaluation, but I don't think she has sufficient knowledge of the man to be able to determine how relevant ANY found info is likely to be

This is the problem with more than one thread about the same person…….having to cross-refer, instead of just looking at earlier posts on the same thread

???? Maybe?? Wild stab in the dark! The only one I can find with father Philip.


Birth record for Anne Ryan
/ Thurles « Back to results
Name: Anne Ryan
Year of Birth: 1866
Group Registration ID: 7879136
SR District/Reg Area: Thurles

Parents: Philip Ryan and Mary Doyle, Ballyvoneen

ADDED:

But NO - James , Mary, and Anne's mother was Annie.

Possibly Bridget and aunt Anne in 1911:

Bridget McEnery
in the Web: Ireland, Census, 1911
Name Bridget McEnery
Gender Female
Age 26
Birth Year abt 1885
Birth Place Tipperary
Residence Date 2 Apr 1911
House Number 32
Townland/Street Dillon Street
District Tipperary West Urban
County Tipperary
Country Ireland
Electoral District Tipperary West Urban
Literacy Read and write
Marital Status Single
Religion Roman Catholic Church
Relationship Niece
URL
Household Members (Name) Age Relationship
Anne Ryan 48 Head
Bridget McEnery 26 Niece
Julia Burke 32 Boarder


If so - different age for Anne/Annie (c1863 instead of c1870).

Death of Philip Ryan:


Death record for Philip Ryan
Name: Philip Ryan
Date of Death: 1883
Group Registration ID: 6169071
SR District/Reg Area: Tipperary
Deceased Age at Death: 80

Address: Foilaclug <<<<<<
Informant: son James Ryan

I have a rememberance card with his photo on saying died at his residence in Foilaclug age 84 and date of death 24th November 1937 Roman Catholic

James and Kate's children were born c1910-1918-ish.

Going by the 1937 death at age 75 - on other thread - James was born c1862.

The 1911 census indicates that his birth was c1861.
1901 census suggests c1865.

1901 census shows his mother as Annie.

There's no record of his birth in 1861-2.

There's a James Ryan in 1864, in Kilgarriff, Cappagh - father Thomas and mother Johanna (nee Ryan), which might be abbreviated to Annie.
But no way of proving if that's "your" James's birth or not. [EDIT: No, it's not.]

I don't see the birth of an Annie (or similar name) c1870 with the same parents.
Also don't see the birth of James's niece Bridget (in 1901 census), nor a marriage of her parents.

As ErikaH says, if the record isn't on the sites mentioned, there's no record.


ADDED:

Possible birth of Bridget:


Birth record for Bridget Mcinerny
Name: Bridget Mcinerny
Year of Birth: 1882
Group Registration ID: 11565183
SR District/Reg Area: Tipperary
Father: Stephen McInerny
Mother: Mary, formerly Ryan


Parents' marriage:

Marriage record for Stephen Mcnerny and Mary Ryan
Party 1 Name: Stephen Mcnerny
Party 2 Name: Mary Ryan
Date of Event: 26/09/1880
Group Registration ID: 2686408
SR District/Reg Area: Thurles

Mary's address: Foilaclug.
Father's name: Philip Ryan.

In which case, the 1864 birth for James isn't the right one.

The 1901 census on your OTHER thread about this man shows him to have had two sisters, at least, and also gives you his mother’s name and age

Not sure why you have again given his birth year as 1853 :-S :-S

Irish records are very limited…………if you can’t find info on the sites you’ve been given, it doesn’t exist

Have you used all the sites given to you in your Advice needed thread?

Sorry I mean brothers and sisters of james Ryan 1853 - 1937 I have found all there children. Annie, Philip, Cornelious, Johanna and Margaret (sister Mechtildes a nun) and Philip which is my sisters father in law

Related threads:

https://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/ancestors/thread/1404247

https://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/ancestors/thread/1404265


Do you mean siblings (ie - brothers and sisters) of James, or do you mean children?
The wording of your post is a bit confusing.

"i still cant trace them" - who?

If you mean Cecilia and Dolly, as mentioned in your other thread - we have searched, but can't find any existing record of their births.