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We are trying to look into the background of Thomas James Gouldbourne and his brother Patrick. Thomas dob is 14/11/1930 we have had a little success but we may have got the surname wrong and are now spelling it without the 'D' (Goulbourne) as we do not know for sure as they were orphans. We think now that their parents were Richard Goulbourne & Sheila King, married 1927. We think we have Richard Goulbourne in the 1911 census aged 4yrs but we are not sure because of the confusion with the surname. Any further info from anyone would be great. :-)

This is the spelling for the birth


England & Wales, Birth Index: 1916-2005
Name: Patrick J Goulbourne
Mother's Maiden Surname: King
Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1930
Registration district: Ormskirk
Inferred County: Lancashire
Volume Number: 8b
Page Number: 1362



HIs death?


England & Wales, Death Index: 1916-2006
Name: Patrick James Gouldborne
Birth Date: 17 Dec 1929
Date of Registration: Feb 2005
Age at Death: 75
Registration district: Lancaster
Inferred County: Lancashire
Register Number: G3C
District and Subdistrict: 587/1
Entry number: 84

Welcome to the boards Graham.


Marriages Dec 1927 (>99%)

GOULBOURNE Richard King Ormskirk 8b 1461
KING Sheila Goulbourne Ormskirk 8b 1461

The brith for the Richard age 4 in the 1911 census...

Births Dec 1906 (>99%)
Goulbourne Richard Ormskirk 8b 860

Are you sure about the names and dates, cant see a Thomas James?


There is this one for around that time

John R Goulburn mmn King


England & Wales, Death Index: 1916-2006
Name: John Gouldbourne
Birth Date: abt 1928
Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1942
Age at Death: 14
Registration district: Ormskirk
Inferred County: Lancashire
Volume: 8b
Page: 590

Are you aware of this birth ?

Q3 1828 Ormskirk ref 8b 1416 - John R GOULBURN , mother KING

edit - silly me, should of course be 1928

We are aware of the birth & deaths indexes for Patrick and the marriage of Richard & Sheila King in 1927. We know the dob of Thomas being 14/11/1930 as he is my father in law. But on another message board someone has them the other way round, Thomas being the oldest. He has said his birth date is right even though he hasn't got a birth certificate. So who knows ?

Barry thanks but the name isn't right

Could this be the death of their mother?

England & Wales, Death Index: 1916-2006
Name: Sheila Goulbourne
Birth Date: abt 1903
Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1930
Age at Death: 27
Registration district: Ormskirk
Inferred County: Lancashire
Volume: 8b
Page: 934

(Barry, is that 1828 birth one of their ancestors?)

Just realised that the birth Barry posted should be 1928. Why couldn't that be another brother who died young?

Graham, I'm saying ,is this a birth you didn't know about - Goulbourne,as you sayit is spelt in various ways and for a GOULBURN birth mmn KING I would have thought a pretty unusual combination and it is in Ormskirk !!

Have edited birth year 1828 to 1928 sorry about that

Thanks MarieCeleste,
But we know that both boys were admitted to Leyfield Certified Poor Law School on 8/11/1935 by Richard Goulbourne & Sheila King, so Sheila King was still alive in 1935. They then went on to St Edwards Poor Law School, Broadgreen, Liverpool then to St Vincents Fulwood Preston. Thank you all :-)

Yes Barry you could be right we don't know of any other sibling

But we have heard on other message boards that someone thinks the 2 boys are their great uncles so they must have had brothers or sisters, shame we can't see the 1931 census :-)

Just to put the cat amongst the pigeons

Death Q1 1930 Ormskirk ref 8b 934 aged 27

Sheila Goulbourne

The problem is Graham, is that what you are telling us doesnt add up to the 'facts' that are registered on the GRO?

Do you have a birth certificate for Thomas James b 1930?

No Thomas hasn't got a birth certificate was issued with registration document from the Home Office with nothing on it. Just a stamp in order to obtain passports etc and serve in the Army.

Now you all know what it has been like for us over the years seems like we have been going round in circles and arriving at the same place. :-)

Could this be your Richard Goulbourne ?

Death Q4 1960 Ormskirk ref 10f 156 aged 76

Maybe will have to have a look. Don't know how to find out

Graham, to find out if any of these index records are relevant to the people you're researching then you need to order copies of the certificates.

You can do this on-line from GRO and they cost £9.25. http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/

Are you sure they were actually orphans or were they abandoned?

Did any of them ever marry? - the marriage certificates should name the father.