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Hi, I am after a little bit of assistance if it is not too much trouble.

I am looking for a marriage record of my Wife's great grand-parents Herbert Cooper and Ella Louisa Banham, Herbert was born in 1860 and Ella Louisa was born in 1862. I have tried looking in Thegenealogist and FindMyPast but cannot find them anywhere.

There are on the census 1891 after they are married, complete with the correct children, but not on the 1881 census so I am assuming that they married after 1881.

I only got Ella Louisa's name from the IGI website as they showed them to be the parents of Herbert Montague Cooper, my Wife's grand father.

Any assistance would be appreciated

CW

When was the first child born?
Thanks

Added:
For info about area:
Births Jun 1862
BANHAM Ella Louisa Mitford 4b 275

What were their birthplaces and where and when was Herbert Montague Cooper born?

??

1911

COOPER, Herbert Head Married M 50 1861 Baker Essex Braintree VIEW
COOPER, Ella Wife Married
28 years F 48 1863 Norfolk Litcham VIEW
COOPER, Herbert Son Single M 27 1884 Vannian Kent Sydenham VIEW
COOPER, Ella Daughter Single F 22 1889 Assisting In Business Kent Sydenham VIEW
COOPER, Joseph Son Single M 19 1892 Vanman Kent Sydenham VIEW
BATEMAN, Harry Assisting Single M 19 1892 Baker Herfordshire Rye House VIEW
PIERCE, Florence Servant Single F 27 1884 General Ser Vant Domestic Kent New Cross VIEW

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RG number:
RG14 Piece:
5144 Reference:
RG14PN5144 RG78PN227 RD79 SD2 ED24 SN378

Registration District:
Brighton Sub District:
West Brighton Enumeration District:
24 Parish:
Brighton

Address:
68 Upper North Street Brighton County:
Sussex

?????????????Herbert Montague's birth registration

England & Wales, FreeBMD Birth Index, 1837-1915 about Herbert Montague Cooper

Name: Herbert Montague Cooper
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1882
Registration district: West Ham
Inferred County: Essex, Greater London
Volume: 4a
Page: 183 (click to see others on page)



sylvia

???
Births Jun 1884
Cooper Herbert Montague Lewisham 1d 1146

Jonesey ..... that fits better with the census information from Choccy!

Did Herbert Montague marry Rose Margaret Simmons in 1915? If so the marriage cert is on Ancestry.

1891 for reference

LLOYD, Caroline Head Widow F 58 1833 Dress Maker
Cheltenham
Gloucestershire VIEW
LLOYD, Florence Daughter Single F 17 1874 Domestic Servant
Cheltenham
Gloucestershire VIEW
LLOYD, Joseph Grandchild Single M 13 1878 Scholar
Cheltenham
Gloucestershire VIEW
LLOYD, Albert Grandchild Single M 8 1883 Scholar
Cheltenham
Gloucestershire VIEW
COOPER, Herbert Lodger Married M 30 1861 Baker
Essex VIEW
COOPER, Lousia Lodger Married F 29 1862 Laundress
Norfolk VIEW
COOPER, Herbert Lodger Single M 7 1884 Scholar
Sydnem VIEW
COOPER, Ella Lodger Single F 3 1888
Sydnem VIEW
HILLING, Arthur Lodger Single M 18 1873 Drayman
Birmingham VIEW
Piece:
2043 Folio:
108 Page:
13 Registration District:
Cheltenham

Civil Parish:
Cheltenham Municipal Borough:
Cheltenham Address:
32, Sherborne Street, Cheltenham County:
Gloucestershire

Do you know if this is her death?
Ella L Cooper
Birth Date: abt 1863
Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1940
Age at Death: 77
Registration district: Brighton
Inferred County: Sussex
Volume: 2b
Page: 907

Herbert and Ella's first child, (wife's grandfather) Herbert Montague was born 13 Mar 1884 in Sydenham, which at the time was Kent.
Ella Louisa was born in Mitford in 1862
Herbert Cooper was born in Essex in 1861.

Many thanks for all of your research so far but as previously stated I have all of the Census (including 1911) records, I have birth records for both Herbert and Ella louisa and their children, but what i am lacking is their marriage record which is frustrating me good and proper.

1881 poss for Herbert - shown as unmarried

Name: Herbert Cooper
Age: 21
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1860
Relation: Servant
Gender: Male
Where born: Springfield, Essex, England

Civil parish: Lambeth
County/Island: London
Country: England

Street Address: No 14 Commerce Pl New Park Road
Education:

Employment status: View image
Occupation: Baker

Registration district: Lambeth
Sub-registration district: Brixton
ED, institution, or vessel: 9
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 614
Folio: 103
Page Number: 13
Household Members: Name Age
James Paddy 55
Walter Midhurst 24
Herbert Cooper 21
Louisa J. Buskwell 54
Ellen Coard 23
Ann Appleby 57

Christine, Yes Herbert Montague did marry Rose Margaret Simmons, but what i am trying to find out is the marriage record for Herbert Montagues parents.

Alviegal, thanks

Patchem, yes that is Ella's death record.

We are trying to pin down the family, see where the children were registered, check that they were not married before, see if she normally goes by the name Ella L, or Louisa, or something else, wonder if there was a a reason why they did not marry, look for possible differences in spellings, etc etc.
If you have looked and cannot find it, do not expect us to do so without working around the problem. so we can get a handle on it.

CW

just one explanation of why we seem to be repeating information that you have

You have this family in "your head"

We do not, and we have to get that feeling for the family ...... and we do need basic information that you did not give us.

Thus, I and several others posted information ...... to get confirmation from you that we were indeed following the right people


Witness the fact that I found on ancestry a Herbert Montague Cooper whose birth was registered in 1882, while Jonesey found what you say is yours on freebmd!



sylvia

Patchem, You are quite right, I have tried searching on thegenealogist and findMyPast for all of the herbert coopers married between 1880 and 1884 and looked at their partners with no avail.
I have also looked at Ella Louisa Banham, Ella Banham or just banham berween 1880 and 1884 to see if any of them married a cooper, no joy there either, I am thinking that they did not get married, but i would rather be certain.

Thank for looking

CW


you do realise don't you that we are all members of GR, just like you.


NO GR staff help on these boards ......... it's all volunteer work by GR members



Thus we have no magic wand .................... we have to search records on sites that we subscribe to, or know about.


Like patchem said ................... if a marriage is hard to find, then one always thinks about a) a previous marriage for the woman that means she used a different surname, or b) that they did not marry at all, for some reason.


sylvia

CW

have you also looked at freebmd.org.uk?

Sylvia, you are quite correct and I apologise, this has been haunting me for a while and everytime I log on and start researching I end up spending hours on-line and achieve nothing.

I do appreciate all of the efforts everyone is makiing.

just one question



does anyone think that the landlady on the 1881 Census gave the wrong information for Herbert (if that is the correct Herbert)??

ie, in saying he was single when he was in fact already married?




sylvia