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Hello,
I am trying to find any information on twin brothers Fred and H. lrwin born 29th July 1882 Cumberland, England, who claimed on their Attestation papers on entry in 1915 that their next of kin was their mother Ann Fearon who lived in Seascale, Cumberland
H. Irwin had previously served 7 years with the Cameron Highlanders in Africa, India, Hong.Kong and North China.
To date i have been unable to establish a link between the twins and Ann Irwin, i am still trying to solve the mystery.

Kind Regards

Irene Cooper

Ann Fearon is Ann Irwin?

T x

:-D

Looks like mum remarried?

1891 RG number: RG12 Piece: 4320 Folio: 19 Page: 20
Reg. District: Bootle Sub District: Muncaster
Address: Taylors Cottages, South Parade, Drigg & Carleton, Seascale County: Cumberland
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
FEARON, Isaac Head Married M 37 1854 Locomotive Engineer Cleator Cumberland
FEARON, Ann Wife Married F 39 1852 Ponsonby Cumberland
IRWIN, Fred Stepson M 11 1880 Scholar Cleator Cumberland

The marriage....

Marriages Dec 1890
Fearon Isaac Bootle 10b 1085
IRWIN Ann Bootle 10b 1085

Simples...

T x

:-D

why initial, why not full names ?

hm, why can't I find a Fred* Irwin born after March quarter in 1882 ?

can you give some verified and full information ?

who is Ann Irwin that you are trying to establish a connection with ... did you mean Ann Fearon ?

take a deep breath and start over maybe :-)

Chrissie

I have solved the mystery..... i think this person just hasn't gone back far enough in the census's.

T x

:-D

WayneTracey that was my next move :-) ( the marriage )

I just thought it odd that such sketchy information was given ...

the births must have been registered as some other surname ?

there are these two births ( Cleator is in Whitehaven registration district )

Births Sep 1882
Bone Frederick Albert Whitehaven 10b 642
Wilkinson Frederick Dixon Whitehaven 10b 649

but no other birth for either surname in the same quarter

where is 'H' in 1891 ?

all very odd

I've answered the question as asked rather than analysing the details of the question.

I shall take a squint now.


T x

1881


Name: Freddy Irwin
Age: 1
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1880
Relation: Grandson
Gender: Male
Where born: Cleator, Cumberland, England

Civil parish: Gosforth
County/Island: Cumberland
Registration district: Whitehaven

William Irwin 52
Christian Irwin 51
Ann Irwin 30
Annas Irwin 13
William Irwin 22
Curwen W. Irwin 20
George Irwin 12
Emma G. Irwin 10
Freddy Irwin 1


so who is this mystery 'H' ?

and how did Freddy born 1882 appear in the 1881 census ?


Births Sep 1879
Irwin Annie Mary Whitehaven 10b 595
> Irwin Frederick Whitehaven 10b 642
Irwin Lizzie Isabel Whitehaven 10b 607

OK, don't know whom H Irwin is, but they're not a twin of Freddy?

1881 RG number: RG11 Piece: 5194 Folio: 66 Page: 3
Reg. District: Whitehaven Sub District: Egremont
Address: The Villas, Gosforth County: Cumberland
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
IRWIN, William Head Married M 52 1829 Retired Farmer St Johns Cumberland
IRWIN, Christian Wife Married F 51 1830 Ponsonby Cumberland
IRWIN, Ann Daughter Single F 30 1851 Ponsonby Cumberland
IRWIN, Annas Daughter Single F 13 1868 Scholar Ponsonby Cumberland
IRWIN, William Son Single M 22 1859 Ag Lab Ponsonby Cumberland
IRWIN, Curwen W Son Single M 20 1861 Joiner Ponsonby Cumberland
IRWIN, George Son Single M 12 1869 Scholar Ponsonby Cumberland
IRWIN, Emma G Daughter Single F 10 1871 Scholar Ponsonby Cumberland
IRWIN, Freddy Grand Son Single M 1 1880 Cleator Cumberland

This is Ann Irwin living with her parents, looks like Freddy was base born?


T x

:-D

that's what I posted :-)

I also find no attestation papers at Ancestry for Fred* Irwin matching these facts

I think there is maybe a cross match of data somewhere..... it's either the details of the births/twins. or (as is more likely) incorrect military records have been attached to the wrong person?

I do wonder if the military records this person ahs found do relate to Freddy, but that maybe that THIS Freddy doesn't relate to the family concerned.

There are no twin births in Cumberland for the name Irwin in 3Q 1882, that is a fact.

We need to OP to come back and give more info i think.

I still do wonder if we simply just have the wrong records being attached just because 'they look like they fit'

T x

:-D

but I've found a missing link

IRWIN, FRED 29/07/1882 21712

http://data2.archives.ca/cef/gpc007/412819a.gif

the things it really helps to know

the attestation papers are >>> Canadian

there is no H* Irwin with a matching birthdate there

I suspect someone has misread the handwritten 'F Irwin' on Fred's papers which looks like 'H Irwin'


edit to add the search form for CEF attestation papers

http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/databases/cef/001042-100.01-e.php

search for Fred Irwin to get the two attestation papers ( see post below )

found Fred in 1911 census.
Baird Barracks. Bangalore.
Name Fred Irwin
Condition / Years Married / Years
Gender
Age 29
Estimated Year of Birth 1882
Occupation None
Employed N
Working at Home N
Place of Birth Cumberland Seaxeale
Military Rank Private 2 Cameron Highlanders.

LOL Chrissie...

So i could be right... they have simply attached the wrong paperwork to their person.

Gotta love the guessing games.


T x

Mr H Fearon???

Sept Q 1882 - Fearon Henry Wigton 10b 524


T x

:-D

the Canadian papers for Fred Irwin do give Ann Fearon

hang on there are two

IRWIN, FRED 29/07/1882 781580 - 23 Sept 1914
http://data2.archives.ca/cef/gpc007/412819a.gif

IRWIN, FRED 29/07/1882 21712 - 28 Dec 1915
http://data2.archives.ca/cef/gpc007/412827a.gif

they are both for the same person

there is no twin

it's just that the answer to 'what is your name' on the first one looks like 'H Irwin' but it is clearly recorded in the Canadian archives as Fred Irwin


what a dog's breakfast

it does seem to be the right Fred who has got his birthdate wrong

son of Ann Irwin who married Fearon

Weirdly there is a H Fearon born in the right Q in the right area in 1882.

just proves you can make anything fit if you wanted to.


T x

no, wait, wait

the details on the two are different and if they are filled out by the men they are in very different hands

same date of birth same mother

one is a machinist, one a clerk

one 7 years in 2nd Cameron Highlanders in Africa, one 7 months in ?th rifles of Canada

but the later one could be referring to time served after the 1914 enlistment and before the 1915 enlistment, the most recent service at the time

yes I'm still convinced it is the same person, the thing that looks like 'H' in handwriting is definitely really an 'F'

for some reason he enrolled and served 7 months and then re-enrolled the next year

A big thank you to all that has worked on this for me.
I do think that you may be right that they attached the wrong paperwork.
Through a relation, it is said that Fred, born 1880 and Emma Glaister Irwin
born 1871, the latter to Alexander Farquharson , a Scottish baker with a wife and children who employed Ann Irwin as a Confectioner in his bakers shop in Cleator Moor.



Once again thank you to all

Irene Cooper