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Wondering about this family....???Large age gap between 8 year old child and baby,sometimes points to a 2nd marriage, however I can`t see a marriage for a Philip Davies to an Elizabeth Owen, but can see a one for John Davies in that area...

May be a complete red herring but may be worth tracking this couple to see if there is any link..

DAVIES, Phillip Head M 33 1838 Monmouthshire VIEW
DAVIES, Elizabeth Wife F 32 1839 Glamorgan VIEW
DAVIES, Elizabeth Jane Daughter F 8 1863 Glamorgan VIEW
DAVIES, Elthmay Daughter F 0 1871 Glamorgan VIEW
EVANS, Thomas Nephew M 13 1858 Glamorgan VIEW
WOOLARD, Francis Boarder M 21 1850 Suffolk VIEW

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RG number:
RG10 Piece:
5400 Folio:
30 Page:
14

Registration District:
Merthyr Tydfil Sub District:
Merthyr Tydfil, Upper Enumeration District:
17 Ecclesiastical Parish:


Civil Parish:
Merthyr Tydfil Municipal Borough:
Address:
Mary Ann St, Merthyr Tydfil, Merthyr County:
Glamorganshire



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Nicky

To find the possibility of Elizabeth remarrying i`d first look at all the David Owen deaths after 1864 in the Mountain Ash reg district..Is that Aberdare? i don`t know.

then you`d need to look at all the the Elizabeth Owen marriages, { To a Davies if thats the name you think is most likely} and see if you can match them to a partner and try and elimainate them one by one in the census`s, using birthplace and age, and maybe having a child Elizabeth with her born c 1864..

It will be a bit of a needle in a haystack job, but if it did all take place in the Mountain Ash area you may get lucky...

As Madmeg says it may be an awful lot of work with no results.

Record your findings so you don`t keep going back over the same people..

good luck



Nicky

Hi Craig. unfortunately with all these common names and places, it simply just might not work, i.e. you might get nowhere.

Sorry to be negative, and I hope I am wrong.

Meg

Thank you Nicky am very grateful for help :)

May be worth getting in touch with.....you never know what information they may be able to help you with..


Mountain Ash Library
Knight Street
Mountain Ash
CF45 3EY

Telephone (01443) 473200

E-Mail [email protected]|



Nicky

not online no, well not that i am aware off. So say now Elizabeth did re-marry, how may i know if she did?

on the marriage record it would state that she was a widower right? if i get one that looks close that is.

Just find it strange that they dont pop up on time, thats why I thought maybe a remarriage took place and then the mother changed their names on the census to her new husbands name? thats the only logical thing i can think of for why they wouldnt be found under Owen/Owens.

But thanks Nicky, nice to have a fresh pair of eyes, because this one has got me stumped lol

I think all this feesable Craig , but I can see the problem your having in proving this..

Have you looked at anyParish Records for Mountain Ash? Are there any available online?


Searching those may help prove your theorys ...


Nicky

I have looked but nothing i can find. All i know is the Prichard family (Elizabeth as the head) is shown in the 1861 census as living in Llangynwyd, Cwmdu. Thanks all i know of them, so dunno if they moved on or stayed there

Also Elizabeth is 42 shown as married but is head, and she is a China shop keeper. (1861 census)

Checked the addresses in Woodland street and Commercial street in1881 and 1891 ,but neither of them were living there then.


Too many David Davies to hazard a guess at the witnesses identity...

I`m wondering if both of Elizabeths parents died before the 1871 census.??

Have you checked her mother Elizabeths family { the Prichards} in 1871 to see if shes with them?



Nicky


Nicky

The reason why I think Elizabeth Owen (nee Prichard) re-married was because I was watching Coming Home on BBC 1 a while ago and Michael Ball was doing his family tree. Well it came to one point and It said about Henry Prichard and his family. Well it showed the 1861 census where Henry's wife was listed as head and it was exactly the same as my census and family which I research. Well Michael Balls descendents moved to Mountain Ash, and its just a coincidence that is where my side settled.

Only thing is I think that michael balls family were Davies (a Prichard married a Davies) and I believe this Prichard was Elizabeth who had previous married David Owens. As I know he died before Elizabeth Owen (his daughter) married at the age of 21 (roughly), I thought maybe her mother re-married and had children which where Michael's ancestors ....

what you think?

yes that is my family, because Rachel Williams (my gran), their daughter was born in 100 High St Mountain ash. Thanks Nicky

For ref. 1891..

WILLIAMS, William Head Married M 29 1862 Coal Miner
?
Monmouthshire VIEW
WILLIAMS, Elizabeth Wife Married F 25 1866
Mountain Ash
Glamorganshire VIEW
WILLIAMS, David John Son M 2 1889
Mountain Ash
Glamorganshire VIEW
WILLIAMS, William E Son M 0 (6M) 1891
Mountain Ash
Glamorganshire VIEW

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RG number:
RG12 Piece:
4416 Folio:
44 Page:
13

Registration District:
Pontypridd Sub District:
Llanwonno Enumeration District:
21 Ecclesiastical Parish:
St Margarets

Civil Parish:
Llanwonno Municipal Borough:
Address:
100, High Street, Llanwonno, Mountain Ash County:
Glamorganshire




Nicky

The witnesses at Elizabeth Owens and William Williams marriage is a David Davies and a David John Davies and Elizabeth gives her address as 47 Woodland st. Mountain ash and Williams is 57 Commercial Street, Mountain ash.

Yeah I dont think it my family because Elizabeth states her father is dead by the time she married. As far as I know she wouldnt lie about it as she was very very religious and was all about family ....mmm... thanks again :)

PS thanks Nicky i did have it and thats how i knew for def that Elizabeth was born in Mountain Ash, Rachel Williams their daughter is my gran. Thanks again much appreciated.

1911... you didn`t say if you had this or not..

WILLIAMS, William Head Married M 49 1862 Coal Miner Haulier Ynysdder Mon VIEW
WILLIAMS, Elizabeth Wife Married
23 years F 44 1867 Glamorgan Mountain Ash VIEW
WILLIAMS, David John Son Single M 22 1889 Coal Miner Hewer Glamorgan Mountain Ash VIEW
WILLIAMS, William Edward Son Single M 21 1890 Coal Miner Hewer Glamorgan Mountain Ash VIEW
WILLIAMS, Elizabeth Ann Daughter Single F 19 1892 Glamorgan Mountain Ash VIEW
WILLIAMS, Trevor Son Single M 17 1894 Coal Miner Hewer Glamorgan Mountain Ash VIEW
WILLIAMS, Margaret Jane Daughter Single F 14 1897 Glamorgan Mountain Ash VIEW
WILLIAMS, Branwen Daughter Single F 10 1901 School Glamorgan Mountain Ash VIEW
WILLIAMS, Jessie Daughter Single F 7 1904 Glamorgan Mountain Ash VIEW
WILLIAMS, Rachel Daughter Single F 3 1908 Glamorgan Mountain Ash VIEW

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RG number:
RG14 Piece:
32280 Reference:
RG14PN32280 RG78PN1851 RD589 SD2 ED34 SN77

Registration District:
Pontypridd Sub District:
Llanwonno Enumeration District:
34 Parish:
Llanwonno

Address:
20 Copplestone Street Mountain Ash County:
Glamorganshire




Nicky

yeah i did come acrross Mary in the census and did think maybe Elizabeth died and David Owen remarried, just i dunno its taken me about 5 years just to get all this.

Its just a complete mystery why Elizabeth Owens is missing in the census's

Thank you Nicky

Who are the witnesses on the marriage of Elizabeth to William Williams..what adresses do they give...??


Nicky

Could she have lied about her age? or that her father was dec'd?

jax

1891...same family again.....does this prove they are not yours as father David is still alive???

OWEN, David Head Married M 57 1834 Coal Miner
Llida
Pembrokeshire VIEW
OWEN, Mary Wife Married F 46 1845
Llansaintffraid
Cardiganshire VIEW
OWEN, George M Son Single M 20 1871 Coal Miner
Penydarren
Glamorganshire VIEW
OWEN, Jane Daughter Single F 17 1874 Dressmaker
Glamorganshire VIEW

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RG number:
RG12 Piece:
4439 Folio:
22 Page:
7

Registration District:
Merthyr Tydfil Sub District:
Upper Merthyr Tydfil Enumeration District:
10 Ecclesiastical Parish:
Dowlais

Civil Parish:
Merthyr Tydfil Municipal Borough:
Address:
12, Lower Elizabeth Street, Merthyr Tydfil, Dowlais County:
Glamorganshire



Nicky

For reference...the 1871 family that Craig thinks are the correct family except that Elizabeth b c1866 is missing...


OWEN, David Head M 38 1833 Pembrokeshire VIEW
OWEN, Elizabeth Wife F 34 1837 Glamorgan VIEW
OWEN, William J Son M 4 1867 Glamorgan VIEW
OWEN, George M Son M 0 1871 Glamorgan VIEW

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RG number:
RG10 Piece:
5400 Folio:
82 Page:
36

Registration District:
Merthyr Tydfil Sub District:
Merthyr Tydfil, Upper Enumeration District:
19 Ecclesiastical Parish:


Civil Parish:
Merthyr Tydfil Penydarran Ward Municipal Borough:
Address:
Horeb St, Merthyr Tydfil Penydarran Ward, Merthyr Tydfil County:
Glamorganshire



Nicky

This looks like the family you posted for 1871 ,but now with a different wife, this ones called Mary and is 10 years younger than Elizabeth, but the father and children match up..

1881

OWEN, David Head Married M 50 1831 Collier
Clyddau
Pembrokeshire
Wales VIEW
OWEN, Mary Wife Married F 35 1846
Llansanffraed
Cardiganshire
Wales VIEW
OWEN, William J Son Single M 15 1866 Colliers Labourer
Penydarran
Glamorganshire
Wales VIEW
OWEN, George Son Single M 10 1871 Scholar
Penydarran
Glamorganshire
Wales VIEW
OWEN, Jane Daughter Single F 8 1873 Scholar
Penydarran
Glamorganshire
Wales VIEW
OWEN, Thomas Boarder Widower M 60 1821 Founder In Iron Works
Clyddau
Pembrokeshire
Wales VIEW

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RG number:
RG11 Piece:
5315 Folio:
74 Page:
16

Registration District:
Merthyr Tydfil Sub District:
Upper Merthyr Tydfil Enumeration District:
Ecclesiastical Parish:


Civil Parish:
Merthyr Tydfil Municipal Borough:
Address:
18, Bryn Zion St, Merthyr Tydfil County:


Still no sign of Elizabeth born c1866,, and if this is her family her mother had presumably died.


Nicky