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Hi all
Can any body please help me find another possible birth or marriage for Amelia Oakes
I recieved 2 certificates this morning, both were what I thought were her birth and marrige but the father is different on each one throwing me into confusion.
Here is the info I already have
Amelia Oakes b 1st Feb 1892 Chatham, Kent, mother Elizabeth formerly Melville, father Edmund Oakes
Marriage of Amelia Sophia Oakes to Louis Sutton Dec 21st 1915, Surrey, father Henry Oakes, no mother name
Amelia would have been my great grandmother and having spoke to my grandmother she informed me Amelia sometimes used the middle name Sapphire (could be Sophia?) and Louis was sometimes spelt Lewis.
I am working on the possibility that I may have the wrong birth cert but as yet cannot locate another birth and would be grateful of any help.
Hope I have put enough info without being to long winded!
Lisa x

There is this marriage in Kent:-

Name: Amelia Oakes
Spouse Surname: Charlie Edwards
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1920
Registration district: Medway
Registration county (inferred): Kent
Volume Number: 2a
Page Number: 1872

What is your grandmother's name? If you have her birth certificate it should give the full names of her parents.

Kath. x

1901

Name: Amelia Oakes
Age: 9
Estimated birth year: abt 1892
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Edmund
Mother's Name: Elizabeth
Gender: Female
Where born: Chatham; Luton, Kent, England

Civil parish: Chatham
Ecclesiastical parish: Chatham Christchurch
County/Island: Kent
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View image

Registration district: Medway
Sub-registration district: Rochester and Chatham
ED, institution, or vessel: 42
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 168
Household Members: Name Age
Edmund Oakes 40 Shipwright
Elizabeth Oakes 38
Lena Oakes 16
Walter Oakes 14
Frederick Oakes 11
Amelia Oakes 9
Marjory Oakes 4
Edward Oakes 2

Source Citation: Class: RG13; Piece: 729; Folio: 124; Page: 28.


What was Henry's occupation on the marriage certificate please?


I am not instantly seeing an Amelia with father Henry on the 1901 census so I am wondering if Edmund could have been Henry Edmund or Edmund Henry ?

Could this be the birth and she just changed the names around for her marriage:-

Name: Sophia Amelia Oakes
Year of Registration: 1893
Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
District: Camberwell
County: Greater London, London, Surrey
Volume: 1d
Page: 891

Kath. x

Hi Kath

my granmothers name is laura Sutton, I dont have her cert as she filled me in as best she could, informing me of her parents names, confirmed by my father, although since this morning I am considering ordering it

Lisa x

rootgatherer

Henrys ocupation is Baker

Does the year of birth tie in with the age Amelia has give on her marriage certificate (I am assuming that your Gran has confirmed that her parents were Amelia and Louis / Lewis, so the marriage is correct)?

I think the birth of Sophia Amelia in 1893 may be a good bet. It's the only birth I can see of an Amelia Oakes with any reference to the name Sophia.

Kath. x

This looks like the Amelia that you have the birth certificate for?

1901

Name: Millia Oakes
Age: 7
Estimated birth year: abt 1894
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Henry
Gender: Female
Where born: Peckham, Surrey, England

Civil parish: Camberwell
Ecclesiastical parish: St Mark
County/Island: London
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View image

Registration district: Camberwell
Sub-registration district: Peckham
ED, institution, or vessel: 61
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 27
Household Members: Name Age
Henry Oakes 63 Baker's Carman, Widower
Harry Oakes 19
Percy Oakes 15
Edith Oakes 9
Millia Oakes 7
Nellie Norman 18


Source Citation: Class: RG13; Piece: 514; Folio: 26; Page: 4.

Kath
I'm liking that idea!
Rootgatherer,
her marriage shows her as one year younger on her cert

Now here's the same family in 1891 and look at the mother's name!

Name: Sophia Oaks
Age: 30
Estimated birth year: abt 1861
Relation: Wife
Spouse's name: Henry
Gender: Female
Where born: Camberwell, London, England

Civil parish: Camberwell
Ecclesiastical parish: St Marks
Town: Peckham
County/Island: London
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View image

Registration district: Camberwell
Sub-registration district: Peckham
ED, institution, or vessel: 8
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Henry Oaks 51 Baker's Vanman
Sophia Oaks 30
Grace Oaks 12
Harry Oaks 7
Percy Oaks 5
Albert Oaks 2
Eath Oaks 6/12

Source Citation: Class: RG12; Piece: 474; Folio 86; Page 19; GSU roll: 6095584


So I would say if you are sure that your Great grandparents names were Amelia and Louis / Lewis then it looks to me like you have the wrong birth certificate.

It is also worth noting that it was fairly common for a daughter named for her mother is use her middle name to avoid confusion in the family.

Thank you all so much for your help, I would love to know how you do it and am always very grateful
I have plenty here to work with and will get to the bottom of it
My 'wrong' cert I will post on bmd share
Thanks again
Lisa x

Just for good measure, it looks like Sophia Amelia's Mum die from childbirth complications?

Surname First name(s) Age District Vol Page

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Deaths Dec 1893 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Oakes Sophia Amelia 34 Camberwell 1d 660




Looks like it was a second marriage for Henry

1881

Name: Grace Oakes
Age: 2
Estimated birth year: abt 1879
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Henry
Mother's Name: Fanny
Gender: Female
Where born: Peckham, Surrey, England

Civil parish: Camberwell
County/Island: London
Country: England

Street Address: 35 Clayton Rd
Education:

Employment status: View image

Registration district: Camberwell
Sub-registration district: Peckham
ED, institution, or vessel: 8a
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Henry Oakes 41
Fanny Oakes 40
Arthur Oakes 11
Grace Oakes 2


Source Citation: Class: RG11; Piece: 682; Folio: 14; Page: 22; GSU roll: 1341158.

Thanks rootgatherer
could Fanny be short for Frances?

One of the witnesses to the marriage of Amelia and louis was Arthur Oakes,so there is another connection to 1881 census showing Arthur age 11.
The address they were at at time of marriage was 6,Ellery Street for both of them.
It says louis was a soldier,dad John Henry Sutton a platelayer.Desceased.

Yes Frances is another name for fanny.

Maryb

thank you Mary x

ok, if anybody comes back to view this,
can you believe the only mother I can find for the Amelia Sophia who is actually Sophia Amelia is actually born Amelia Sophia and not Sophia Amelia.
How very confusing!
I cant wait to get these certificates ordered
Lisa x

Wouldn't it be great if we could go back in time and ask our ancestors why they like to make it so difficult for us, lol

Kath. x

haha, I think they saw me coming and knew it wouldnt take much to confuse me

Lisa x

Lisa

Did you find a marriage for Henry and Sophie? I couldn't see anything obvious but perhaps I was just missing it.