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is there any other way of tracking down a birth?
Lily/Lilby/Silby/Sylvia Myrtle Messervy!!!
Born approx 1889/1890 in Forest Gate, essex (info as per 1891 census which states she was 2 years and was called Lilby)
1901 census says she was Sylby and aged 10
Lily's (Lily Myrtle) marriage cert in June 1915 to George Henry Merrick (St Judes Peckham) advises she was 25 years old.
Her death cert in 1923 says she was 35 years old and states her name as Sylvia Myrtle Merrick (death witnessed and reg'd by widow GH Merrick)
Her mother was one Jesse Matilda Messervy (nee FOX) and father was a William Ernest Messervy.
Have searched all combo's of Lily's christian name mixed with either Fox or Messervy so I am guessing I am looking too hard and can't see the wood for the trees!! Is it poss to search for all children borne by her mother or am I being unrealistic??
(her father was a "ladys man" whose secret escaped in 1902)
Ever hopeful

Births Jun 1891 (>99%)
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Messervy William Ernest Wandsworth 1d 807
Births Jun 1895 (>99%)
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Messervy Francis Henry Wandsworth 1d 757

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Births Jun 1896 (>99%)
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Messervy Maud Lilian Camberwell 1d 906

1911 census
HOUSEHOLD MESSEROY FRANCIS HENRY M 1896 15 Camberwell London
HOUSEHOLD MESSEROY JESSIE MATILDA F 1864 47 Camberwell London
HOUSEHOLD MESSEROY MAUD LILIAN F 1897 14 Camberwell London
HOUSEHOLD MESSERVY WILLIAM E M 1862 49 Camberwell London

Just a note - never go by any site's transcription of census records alone; always look at the original image.

L transcribed as S and vice versa are among Ancestry's most common errors, for instance.

There's a William Ernest Messervy marriage in 1904 -- the page transcription shows 3 grooms and 2 brides -- do you know whom he married, Marina?

Jessie's death was reg as Messervy

Name: Jessie M Messervy
Death Registration Month/Year: 1950
Age at death (estimated): 87
Registration district: Camberwell
Inferred County: London
Volume: 5c
Page: 183

but it's looking like they weren't married ...

Any chance she had been married before? Can't see such a marriage ...

HI There
Apologies for delay all!
William Ernest remarried in 1904 to a lady called Daisy. His first marriage was to an Ada Jane Le Riche. She divorced him in spectacular style in 1902 on grounds of cruelty and adultery (I have copies of the court papers from the national archives and he really was beast to be polite so I can only assume he had the looks and plenty of smooth talking)
I don't think Jesse and William ever married and looking att he 1911 census it shows Jesse as married and total children to her marriage was three!?!?!? I wonder if Lily.Lilby etc came from elsewhere (my imagination is wondeerful as accordingto the NA papers there were two deceased children to his marriage with Ada)
Looking at Jesses death cert it states her as a widow of Francis Henry Messervy, a commercial traveller which completely threw me as I believed Francis was her son!! Her death was reg'd by Percy Messervy
I have searched for Lily's birth under all variations of name and wonder if it isa worthwhile task for me to search parish baptism records in Forest Gate for any baptism of Lily???
She came from somewhere - just where! Was she born Fox or Messervy or was she a product of a dalliance with some other lady and Jesse tookher on?? I have a vivid imagination!
Oh dear .... the search continues ....

1911 Silbey Messer 1892 Odiham? Hants she is a mothers help at Upton Andover.

Maryb

Hi Mary
Thank you- I will investigate further :o)
M

Here ya go, I think.

Births Sep 1888
JEFFREY Silby Myrtle W. Ham 4a 115


Exactly the right age, name and registration district!

Oh My Word!! JaneyCanuck you are fab :oD

I will have to apply for this cert as I would never have found it for a month of wet Sundays

The Christian names are far too unusual to be anyone else other than my Lily ..... Fingers and Toes crossed on this one as she has haunted me for a very long time (trying to track her grave too but Southwark Cemetaries want £16.50 to look! So will have to trot down to Peckham to do it for free). I even have a couple of pics of the lady but so far the birth has eluded me (...until now)
Jeffery .... soposs William wasn't her father unless another mistranscribe on the birth cert??

Thank you all again

Heh, the trick was just to search *without* a surname.

Only 4 Silby-s born 1887-1891, none anywhere in that vicinity but that one, so she kind of stood out. ;)

Do report back when it comes!

Thank you - and there's a tip for future research too

Will update you when the certificate comes back

She would have been a good woman to take on a child of her husband's dalliance. More likely the child of a sister. I'd trace her siblings - if I could find her (Jessie Matilda) on a census pre-marriage that is.

Sorry, but is it me? William Ernest married wife 1, Ada Jane Le Riche, who divorced him in 1902, he remarried wife 2, Daisy in 1904 (she's the missing bride on freebmd) - but in 1911 he is with Jessie Matilda masquerading as her husband?

Wonder if this is Daisy in 1911?

Relation Condition/
Yrs married Sex Age Birth
Year Occupation Where Born Original
census
image

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CONLAN, Jane Occupier Single F 54 1857 Privat Means India Calcutta VIEW
CONLAN, Amy Single F 47 1864 India Afra VIEW
BEALE, Florence Boarder Single F 25 1886 Independent Bimouth Resident VIEW
MESSEROY, Daisy Boarder Married F 30 1881 Traveller For Corsets Enfield VIEW
HORNSBY, Lilian Boarder Single F 28 1883 Underclothing Machinist Bermondsey VIEW

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RG number:
RG14 Piece:
2507 Reference:
RG14PN2507 RG78PN84 RD27 SD3 ED23 SN249

Registration District:
Camberwell Sub District:
Camberwell North EnumerationDistrict:
23 Parish:
Camberwell

Address:
25 Kerfield Cresent County:
London

Hi MadMeg
It sure is the same Daisy in 1911 and going by all the 1911 census returns it seems that William, Jesse and Daisy all worked in Corsets
William died a couple of years after the 1911 census and one of the causes was toxaemia.... there was another cause on his death cert but I couldn't (as of yet) read it
Many thanks

1911 Jessie Matilda widow born 1864 door to door canvaser.
Percy 1893
Francis henry 1896
Maud Lillian 1897.

No William with them that I can see.
1911 William e Messervy born Jersey married commision agent
On his own

21,Elmington Rd Camberwell
Maryb

2 more from 1911 census
Schedule type Last names First names Sex Birth year Age in 1911 District / other County / other Transcript Original page
HOUSEHOLD MESSEROY DAISY F 1881 30 Camberwell London

HOUSEHOLD MESSEROY PERCY M 1893 18 Camberwell London

Births Mar 1864 (>99%)
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FOX Jessie Matilda Camberwell 1d 566

In 1904 he married a Daisy Willis 1d 506 Lambeth

A possibility Jessie was married to Williams brother
another missing bride
Surname First name(s) District Vol Page

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Marriages Dec 1889 (>99%)
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Butler Mary Lydia Kensington 1a 250
MEIKLE Robert Ellot Kensington 1a 250
>>>>>>>>MESSERVY Ernest Francis Kensington 1a 250
NICOL Margaret Dyce Kensington 1a 250
PEARCY Edmund Kensington 1a 250

There are 3 men and 2 women on the marriage 1 woman missing

Hmmmm .... have looked att his but it seems Ernest Francis married a Margaret so not a poss - worth a look though. I am thinking that Jesse and William Ernest never did "marry"
Thank you though