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i have the birth cert for a James C Matthams, it has the mothers name as Jean M Stuart, dont think this is the right persons as the mane on the wedding cert looks like Newton, definatly has TON on the end of her fathers name

Oops.

Gotta watch those names ............................. ;)

I'm glad you are with me Janey but I am Dea!!! - Dee is Denise (my friend) tee hee !!

We often work together just to confuse!

Dea x

I'm with Dee -- was going to suggest that.

It's a rare certificate that is *totally* unintelligible. At least a couple of alternative possibilities might be identified, that it might be possible to check out.

--- BUT --- getting a child's birth certificate will give you her birth surname!!!!!

Just a thought Jane,

If you have a local 'photocopy' shop, or a branch of 'Staples, or something similar, even possibly at the local library - I am sure they could scan the cert and e-mail it to you for a VERY small cost (probably not much more than pence!!) - you could then forward it to those willing to take a look??

Dea x

the Bagges on my tree are from the Lambeth area of london, alot ended up living in West Ham, Woolwich area

I have traced the Bagge family along way back, it is them that iam related to through a marriage of Priscilla Bagge to Hughes . I cannot find any record of any Collins anywhere on the tree.

Urgh, that 1911 census -- if you don't ask, it doesn't tell!

Well done, rootgatherer.

I was just over the details i have for Jean Matthams, i am very gratful for all the help and iam checking the information people have supplied

Jane, I don't see anyone saying that Matthams was her birth surname.

She appears to have married Matthams overseas, likely in India.

That is why I was looking for incoming passengers to the UK named Matthams.

You don't seem to want to respond to suggestions made!

If you want her birth surname and you can't find some way of deciphering her husband's name on the marriage certificate, you are going to have to order one of the children's birth certificates. The birth of Walter seems to have been identified, so that would be the one to order.

Nobody's going to be able to wave a magic wand to find the info you need, and you're the one who can find it by doing that!

thanks for help, but she wasnt born a Matthams, Matthams is her first husband name, then she married a Bagge. I am trying to find her Maiden name.
We think it might be Newton.On her marriage cert to Bagge, her father is Samuel John!!! he was an Adjuntant in the 42nd Highlanders and he was dead before she married in 1914.

thanks for all the offfers of help, but i dont have a scanner so iam not able to sent it to anyone.

: Agnes Matthams
Birth Date: abt 1876
Age: 38
Port of Departure: Portland, Oregon, United States
Arrival Date: 15 Dec 1914
Port of Arrival: Liverpool, England
Ports of Voyage: Halifax
Ship Name: Zeeland
Search Ship Database: View the 'Zeeland' in the 'Passenger Ships and Images' database
Shipping Line: White Star Dominion Line
Official Number: 113460

Travelling with her:

Kenneth aged 7
Winifred aged 5
Birdie aged 2??

Does this help?

Dea x

Hi Dea - I saw the offer was made earlier in the thread but no response to that either! That surname really is crucial info, and I'm quite happy to put my reading glasses and thinking cap on!

But then - as was also already suggested - ordering a child's birth certificate would give her birth surname, too.

Can anybody check Ancestry's incoming passenger database? I don't pay the premium for access.

An Agnes Matthams is shown as arriving at some point, but I can't tell when she was born or when she arrived.

The fact that Jean used her middle initial in some records suggests that she might have gone by her middle name. (Possibly because her mother was Jean.)

Hi Janey,

I have sent her a message offering to have a look but no reply as yet.

Dea x

Jane, have you considered the suggestion that you ask others to look at the Matthams-Bagge marriage certificate and see whether they can decipher her father's surname?

If you can scan it, then anyone who wanted to could PM you their email address (of course I always recommend an anonymous one like at gmail!) and you could send the image.

It seems to me that the surname is a pretty valuable bit of missing info, and if it could be determined, that could help you a lot.

thanks for everybodys help

Hi Jane,

If the census details are correct...... you may have to order a birth cert to find out her maiden name???

Surname First name(s) District Vol Page

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Births Jun 1894 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Matthams Walter Chelmsford 4a 478



Dee xx

other info on this thread

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.asp?wci=thread&tk=1144979