General Chat

I have to say I am not entirely 'sure' of John Pilger these days, not entirely sure that he is not just an angry older man with a tendency to see conspiracies where they do not exist ( not unusual, the net is full of them), albeit one who has past glories in investigative journalism to his name and a very convincing way with words ( be aware that a person with a way with words is not necessarily right and not necessarily beyond having their own personal axe to grind).

Maybe I am wrong, and I'm not saying he is in any way untruthful, but the way he sees things may just be one interpretation, and there is always more than one that needs to be considered?

I learnt about this when I visited the village last month.

What has not been reported a) the men are only allowed to touch their own wives so they threw money at the women shopkeepers b) they were slaughtering animals in the streets and leaving the blood there.

A solution? How far would you go with millions of people in the UK as opposed to a couple of hundred in a smallish settlement?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/centralamericaandthecaribbean
/guatemala/11065563/Jewish-sect-expelled-from-Guatemalan-village-after-clashes-with-Mayan-villagers.htm
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An interesting piece by John Pilger:

http://www.counterpunch.org/2017/05/31/terror-in-britain-what-did-the-prime-minister-know/

It's unrealistic to think that interning 'suspects' without trial works. Look at the IRA hunger strikers...they were martyrs in the eyes of many, and what is more inspiring to someone vulnerable ( or patriotic) than to emulate their heroes and be imprisoned or die for the cause?

In any case what are you going to do about home grown extremists? and by that I don't just mean the Islamic ones. What about the white supremacists cloaking their racism in a thin veneer of patriotism? You know the type, they post 'patriotic' slogans on FB whilst spreading lies, which dumb people then believe to be the truth ( without EVER stopping to find a reliable source).


It's a fair point that those who leave this country to fight for ISIS should be stopped from returning, but that isn't going to stop them then staying there to bolster the strength of ISIS or going elsewhere to spread their own particular perversion of Islam, and that is certainly not something anyone wants to see.

The argument would be though that you're then in a police state....that said.....if the price is freedom...and if you've nothing to hide....

Maybe we need to engage our armed forces more
instead of the Police
Lets face it They are their to protect this country
and at the moment some towns and cities need it :-( :-(

And again I hear you Joy and agree in many ways.....but as far as possible I for one would like if possible to work within the decent boundaries our free countries offer....but fully acknowledge that to do so is asking for more trouble.

Turning the other cheek isn't an option any more.

Freedom comes with limits why should the limits always be followed only by the law abiding.

'Detainment, deportation, and exclusion' are the measures Colonel Richard Kemp is calling for with regard to people who are on the police watch list.
The former Commander of the British Forces in Afghanistan, who is also the former Head of Counter Terrorism Intelligence in the Cabinet Office, spoke to Andrew Pierce following the London Bridge terrorist attack. 
He said: "I think what needs to happen is we need to be sweeping these people off our streets. 
"We will find, I would be probably 90 per cent sure, that those people who were shot dead by the police last night, were already known to the police, along with at least 3,000, or 23,000, depending on which figure you accept. 
"Jihadists who are free in the UK, who we know are involved, or connected, with terrorism. Those people need to be, as many as possible, got rid of."

Thanks Maggie

Joy....again don't get drawn into the possible trap of it's only muslims doing evil...anyone is capable of evil in the right circumstances

I am fortunate not to be at any risk where I live
Only two Muslims Families live near me
and they are both decent hard working Families
and to be honest I really like them :-D :-D

And even they have suffered In their own countries
They have come here to live in safety
Which with what's going on sadly worries them to :-( :-(

Many of the terrorists appear to be 'home grown' (ie born here).
The Government needs to stop them being radicalised - and this quite often happens due to disaffection, particularly in the teenage years.
No-one really knows what goes on in 'Free' schools - they're a law unto themselves.

Interesting article about Religious schools here:
http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/i-was-radicalised-at-my-catholic-school-thats-why-birminghams-squalid-religious-schools-frighten-me-a6778261.html

No Joy that's what I'm saying it's not a easy decision to make at all.

If push comes to shove and if the Western world isn't there yet then they're very close, then yes something has to be done.

Some thoughts.
The security services could make those posing a serious threat "disappear". I don't mean shooting them in the street, but quietly removing them and disposing of the bodies.
There is not one single reason for these attacks. And they are not reasons, they are excuses.
Youth clubs. Who would want to run one nowadays, what with CRB checks, and living in fear that some disaffected youth will make an accusation of molestation.
Those going abroad join ISIL or whatever should have their passports revoked and not allowed to return.
Those foreign born who are strongly suspected of terrorism activities should be immediately deported, even if they are claiming asylum. If they claim their rights to a family life, let their families go with them.
I could go on. I don't necessarily agree with all of these, but worth thinking about.

Caroline so you would let them all free and put the rest of us at risk
Just on the off chance they are not involved
I do mean ones that are been watched for good reason

Not the local shop keeper
who works all hours to make a living :-( :-(

By Youth Clubs, Ann, I mean for those already at school - particularly for the 11 - 18 year olds.
Many have closed, due to lack of funding by the Government of local Councils.

I get the deport/intern argument but innocent until proven guilty or we're no better also springs to mind....BUT...that attitude is part of the reason the Western world is where it is right now.

Like I said I don't know except I do know there's no easy over night solution.

Well I think the answer is intern the know activists
Deport the ones that are Major threats along with their Families
(they would Police their own then)
Anybody who was born here exile them if they are connected to Isis
Stop anybody coming back to This country
Who has been fighting or training with ISIS aboard

Failing that try them for treason

Never mind their Human rights
What about the Human rights of the Children and decent people
living in this country That have been let down by our Government
who are seen as a soft touch
They have let far to many here with out decent vetting

Lets also remember Decent Muslims are also appalled
By senseless killing to
Never mind Rest in peace we want to also Live in peace to

Having emigrated from England and immigrated into 2 other countries, as well as living for almost 1 year in a 3rd, my feeling is that an immigrant should integrate into the country to which they have moved That means learning to speak the language, adapting the foods available in the country to replace the ones you cannot get when making meals, acknowledging people even if only by a nod and smile, raising children to be good citizens not isolating them.

You move to another country for a reason .............. a job (as we did), a better life, more money, as a refugee because of impossible conditions in the home country, etc ................ but that is not a reason to import the old country habits and behaviours and expect the new country to adapt to those.

You have the Europeans moving in and living in closed communities. We have mainland Chinese, some of whom never learn English.

I look quite often at a site for British Expats, and am constantly amazed at the Brits who want out of the UK but are surprised to discover that they cannot just walk in to Canada, Australia or NZ, or that they cannot buy or do everything that they would do back "home", or that those countries have different requirements or qualifications needed for trade jobs.

They in reality want to leave the UK but live and work as they would back in the UK, even to the extent of having UK shops. Some of them even refuse to adapt to the Canadian or Australian language ...... and yes, we do speak a "different" English!

Sound vaguely familiar?


Canada had its own terrorism about 20-25 years ago ............... Sikhs fighting Indian and Pakistan politicians for their own country Khalistan. That sounds vaguely familiar, doesn't it?

Fanatical Sikhs moved here and fought both within Canada and in India ........

............ anyone remember the Air India flight that went down off the coast of Ireland in 1985? The bomb on that flight was made by a Sikh living in a city not far away from where I live, and other locals were accused bet never found guilty of providing for both that bomb and the one that went off in Narita Airport Japan on the same day.

Not only that, but we and our daughter were in Toronto the day the Air India flight left, and sat in cafes and coffee shops next to people who were going to board that plane.

Every Sikh religious parade in Canada turned into pitched fighting. Every Gurdwara (temple) election turned into a battle between pro-Khalistan and anti-Khalistan forces. Religious-based schools were set up ............. this one was led by pro-Khalistan people, that one by anti-

Fortunately (?), they only hurt themselves. Members of the wider community.were not targeted, as is currently happening around the world.


Turning to what is happening everywhere now .............. I think many youth are disengaged from normality ......... lack of parental control, poor education, lack of work ???? Who knows. But improvements in all those areas would help!!!


It's a bit like those Brits from the Expat site .............. disenchanted with "home" for whatever reason, there must be something better, grass is greener elsewhere, then the realisation oh h*l it isn't any better here.

make school visits to the local fire station compulsory - they might think twice before setting fire to the mountains - these little oiks who keep setting fire to the Welsh mountainsides need teaching a lesson

Now that I'd like to see...all the mums of the world forcing their kids outside to play sports....should happen doesn't happen. Can't do any harm either, idle hands and all that.