General Chat

SpanishEyes asked on 1st September 2011 about what happened to the 1931 census and I don't think her question was answered. All the records were lost on the night of Saturday 19th December 1942 due to a fire at a store in Hayes, Middlesex. The cause of the fire is not known, it may have been due to a discarded cigarette.

I remember reading that The National Statistician was seeking to use the Statistics and Registration Service Bill 2006 to make it a criminal offence for the disclosure of personal information from any of the documents in her possession – including the 1921 Census.

I can't remember where i read this now, but certainly some doubt was expressed as to the opening of the 1921 Census, ever. Just because other Census' have been opened it should not be naturally assumed that the 1921 will follow the same course. Currently there is NO obligation to open it even after 100 yrs.
A shame, as I am desperately awaiting information from the 1921 before I can go anywhere with my totally lopsided tree (stuck at grandad).....but I still won't petition for its early release despite being stuck at the same brick wall for the last 30+ yrs :-(

K

P.S. The Census Confidentiality Act 1991 (amending certain parts of the 1920 Census Act) states ......"if any person discloses any personal census information to another person, without lawful authority, he shall be guilty of an offence...." blah blah blah, and it makes NO mention of timelines, 100 years or otherwise.

Bridget, My understanding is that the 1921 census will not be released early,

this is from the national archives
The 1921 census and all later censuses remain in the custody of the Office for National Statistics and not The National Archives. No information will be available from these censuses for 100 years after the date they were conducted

So they will be released but not early

Roy

Maybe I am simp,y dimwitted but why will the 1921 census never be opened?

Bridget

I have in my possession a letter from the ONS which states that the 1921 census will not be released early.

When the Census was taken in the UK,
The details taken was on the basis that it would be closed for 100 years,
this was to me the same as any contract between two parties and should be honored

But that's the problem, These days their is no honor, respect, discipline, loyalty, And no consideration for others anymore,

Some people in the UK now think they are the only one in the whole world that counts and they have the right to be given anything they want

I believe we now live in a Me Me Me society that needs to change

But remember that these census records as with any other type of personal document mean different things to different people depending on if the information is about YOU or about someone else,

And as i said in my first post on the subject their are other ways to research your family tree without the census info,

census info just makes it easier, ( No fun in that )

If people don't want to put the years of hard work into researching their Tree then i done think Genealogy is a subject they should take up

Roy

I dont see a problem in say 5 years down the line most of those on it may not still be around,

perhaps some of us wont eh?!!

I dont see how anyone elses family privacy can be affected as to do that one would need to be loopy to want to try and dig muck on anyone elses family past and if cost was upped to a max then noone is going to spend on what dont belong to them......are they?

Yes, although I do realise that we will have this last column next year, I was just saying that I personally think that the details of that column should not be made available as it is, I feel, the contents of this column which could cause the most upset if you see what I mean.

"On the subject of the last column on the 1911 census, I tend to think that the details of that column should not be made available. I think they are confidential information and should remain so and not too sure how beneficial they would be to geneaology anyway. "
- http://www.1911census.co.uk/content/default.aspx?r=24&101 - "The 1911 census information will be released in full on 3 January, 2012, in accordance with the ruling of the Information Commissioner’s Office. On this date the redaction will be reversed and you will be able to see the documents in full."

Whilst I would dearly love to be able to see the 1921 census, I can see perfectly why we cannot. Data protection would say that it should only be used for the purposes if was originally taken and that would not have been for family history yet, as regards family history, I would love it to be made available.

On the subject of the last column on the 1911 census, I tend to think that the details of that column should not be made available. I think they are confidential information and should remain so and not too sure how beneficial they would be to geneaology anyway.

I will not be signing the petition

ChAoTic, me to,

They have to get i think 100,000 signatures for the matter to be looked into/ could be debated in the House of Commons



Roy

This has been a popular subject over recent years, and I've read many a debate about it on here and other sites.

The way I understand it is....Regardless of opening it early, the way the law currently stands is that the 1921 Census won't be opened at all.
Perhaps we should petition for it to be opened in 2022 and be thankful if THAT is agreed :-)


K

Roy, I think for any petition to have an impact on the government the number of people signing would have to run into the millions. I don't think your opposing petition will be needed.

David, posted this thread at 31 Aug 2011 23:45,
When i first looked at the petition at about 09.30 this morning 24 people signed the petition,

I just checked and 27 have now signed at 14.53 1st sept

I think only 3 signatures in that time and over 70 members have viewed this thread shows the level of support and that's just on GR

If next year it looks like gaining momentum then i may start a Petition to stop the 1921 census from being released early

Roy

Agree with Sue and Roy. People were told by the government that the information they gave would not be revealed for 100 years. What, or how sensitive, the information is/isn't is irrelevant. The government made a 'promise' and it should be kept.

This Government and those which have preceeded it have given far too much of our personal details away and I have objected to that strongly.

As much as I would love to find the answers I believe the 1921 census would give me I don't feel able to sign this. It's not about being worried about the info in it but how can I, simply for my own interest that serves no greater good to myself or others, ask for this rule to be changed.

I'm also with Sue in that I wouldn't be happy about my details available to the general public - bad enough that so many companies can get them now - but for them to be available to people I went to school with just because they had paid a few pounds to access them? No thanks.

And PigletsPal also has it spot on.

There are people who have for whatever reason, created a different life for themselves far away from where they started or the circumstances in which they were born. We may not agree with or even know why they did it but we have to respect them. Like PigletsPal says, we are talking about products of the late Victorian/Edwardian era when attitudes were so much different.

To us doing our tree we don't experience the same emotion when we find out that we actually had an ancestor who was committed to an asylum but what if that was my grandmother's sister and my gran knew nothing about it until some family history stranger looking for kin came looking for her?

Matt, you raise the subject of the late Queen Mother being interested in seeing her famiy on the 1901. The Bowes Lyon family were no stranger to secrets. I wonder how much she knew and how distressed she was when the story broke about her own close kin. This article shows clearly the attitudes of the time. I'm all in favour of the truth being known and seeing what the 1921 holds but maybe we don't quite need to know it yet.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4156/is_20020407/ai_n12575854/

Jill

Thanks Joy !

Ditto what Sue and Roy said.

C - the hidden column in the 1911 census:

http://www.1911census.org.uk/
"The details recorded for each person were:

Name and surname
Relationship to head of family
Age - this was recorded in separate columns for male and female
Marital condition
Number of years married (present marriage, question only answered by married women)
Number of children born to present marriage, number that are still living, number who have died. (again present marriage, married women only)
Personal occupation
Industry/service with which worker is connected
Employment status
Birthplace
Nationality (if born in a foreign country)
Infirmity, one of deaf, dumb, blind, lunatic, imbecile or feeble minded. The age at which the "infirmity came on" was also required. This information is considered personally sensitive and will not be available until 2012."

Okay excuse my ignorance...what hidden column in the 1911 census ?