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hi. sorry for delay in reply, having 'MAJOR' computer problems . stan, hi, have already seen the 'sandall' one, did wonder.... have now found that the william randolph walker, died 4/2/1905[ address halifax road, dews or batley] now need to know name of his wife, or some way of finding if he is the same one or not. have never found a birth entry for 'randolph' or 'randall' [middle names]. the only definate thing i know his that his father had the same name ! have been struggling with this branch for months. have had a look on the 1881 discs again, my william is clearly there [ an iron moulder, b manchester, living in batley with his family] no sign of any others of that age and name living in the area. am going back to library to track down the 'randolph' one on local deaths to either eliminate, or not. many thanks sue.

Hi Sue I have looked at Walker births Jan 1845 to Dec 1846. There are lots of William Walker births, too many to go through easily, but very few with two Christian names. Of these, the only one with even a passing resemblance to the one you are researching is William Sandall Walker, Jul-Sep 1846, Chorlton 20 299. I have added the description of Chorlton, which covered the area of south Manchester. This William would only have been 58 in Jan-Mar 1905. However the age at death was often wrong, particularly if the person reporting it had not known the deceased since they were small. This William remains a possibility, but a wider search of Walker births with two Christian names might be prudent. Unfortunately it is also possible that the second one might have been added only at baptism. Chorlton Created 1st July 1837. Abolished 1st January 1925 (renamed Manchester South). Sub-districts : Ardwick; Barton; Chorlton upon Medlock; Didsbury; Hulme; Stretford. GRO volumes : XX (1837-51); 8c (1852-1924). Ardwick, Barton Moss (1837-49), Barton upon Irwell (1837-49), Burnage, Chorlton cum Hardy, Chorlton on Medlock, Davyhulme (1837-49), Didsbury, Flixton (1837-49), Gorton, Hulme, Irlam (1837-49), Levenshulme, Moss Side, Openshaw, Rusholme, Stretford (1837-49), Urmston (1837-49), West Gorton, Withington. Registers now divided between Manchester, Salford and Trafford districts. Regards Stan

Hi, Ok, you have found a birth in 1845 Manchester ... and his marriage cert which states his name as Randall. The death cert that is found in 1905 is the correct age and place. Can I suggest that who ever registered the death could have not KNOWN for sure what Williams middle name was ... "something like Randolph or Randall .. we'll say Randolph " since it doesn't really matter to most folks after one has died. Its just a formality that you have to go through. The only other suggestion is to find a William RANDOLPH Walker born 1845/6, if you find one, then this death is the one born Randolph and you still need to find William Randall Walker death. Does that make sense ? find a birth that matches Randolph ... if you can't, then this Randolph is your Randall with wrong name given at death. Elaine :-) Zoe ...LoL ...didn't see your message ...Great minds think alike !!!

Sue Try checking to see if there is a birth for William Randolph Walker that matches with the date of death i.e. someone with that spelling of name. If theres not then chances are its a misspel/misshear by the registrar and he's your man Zoe

SUE, Its March qtr 1905: (not Dec) William Randolph, 59, Dewsbury, 9b, 397. Elaine :-)

Hi, just been reading through this lot and you may have sorted it by now but just in case not - he might have died at the end of the December and be registered in first quarter of the following year - Jan of Chelmsford

It sounds right to me.My grandfather was known as James Augustus Tocqueville, James Alfred and James Arthur when in fact his birth name was James Auguste.Just depends which certificate you look at!

Hi Sue William Randolph Walker is not on 1837online for Oct-Dec 1905, so you will not find him in the St. Catherine's Index, of which that is a copy. There is no William Walker of that age, nor any William Walker record for Dewsbury. I think you must have either the wrong quarter, or perhaps more likely the wrong year. Regards Stan

helen ! i know its an horrific story . but it shows how much you can find if you dig about enough. wonder how many come accross anything as interesting as yours. sue.

Sue This happened way back in 1862 in Rendcombe, a small village in Gloucestershire near Cirencester. He was called William, the eldest child of my gt gt gt grandparents. According to The Times report he was engaged to be married to an older woman and was living with her and her aged father and her 3-year-old child by another man. He went back to live with his parents after a quarrel, but made it up with her the night he killed her, by cutting her throat. He had been complaining about pains in his head and saying he thought he would go mad. After killing her, he went to the village constable, who was also the blacksmith [the job ran in the same family and my own grandfather was apprenticed to a descendant] to report the crime. The blacksmith was also William's godfather. He was acquitted on the grounds of insanity and I know that he was in Gloucester Gaol under close guard until 1863 when he was taken to Bethlem asylum in London. On the 1871, 81, 91 and 1901 censuses he was in Broadmoor. I am waiting for newscuttings from the local paper from Gloucestershire library and also have applied to Broadmoor for some more details, if only when he arrived and when he died. They wanted me to send proof of my relationship so I've sent a ton of certificates, none of which prove our relationship really. Fingers crossed! Helen

hi shan, thanks. yes i think they might be the same person. have got tomorrow off work and am going to go to hudds library and have a look on the st catherines index again [!] i am determined to get to the bottom of this. as i have no address for him in manchester i cannot even look for him when he was younger. might also try the bradford index for 1871 to see if he stayed there awhile after his first wife died. the only census i DEFINATELY have him on are 1881/91 and 1901. nothing before then. sue.

Hi Sue, i'd tend to go with Elaine, sound's a good bet to me age's date's and place's keep it in mind until it can be proved otherwise.(which it may) never know in this game. Shan

hi helen, wow that must have been a real shock ! what did they do with him ? sue.

Sue No, he's not a menace, he is part of your gene pool. I must admit I'm still reeling from the shock of discovering a madman who committed a murder in my ancestry - he was a menace, poor man. Helen

hi helen. his fathers name was also william randall [randolph ?] walker. there are 1000's of them ! to make matters worse, i have just been on the freebmd new images. and cannot find him on the dec 1905 deaths , this man is a menace. lol sue.

Sue As the dates fit, I think it highly likely that William Randall and William Randolph are one and the same. Either the Randalls on the wedding cert, or the Randolph on the death cert may have been misheard by the registrar and wrongly recorded. Have you tried looking for Randall/Randolph Walker, William's father? Incidentally Randall was my father (another William!)'s 3rd name, after his uncle, who was recorded as Randal, Randel and Randle on various documents! Helen

i would appreciate some fresh eyes to look at this. for months i have been stuck with this branch. i have a william walker [ b 1845/45 in manchester. ] on his 1873 w cert his name was william randall walker. it stated that was also his fathers name. next sighting the 1881, name william r walker. can find no death of a william randall walker, but elaine shawcross [many thanks elaine] found the death of a william randolph walker dec 1905 aged 59 in dewsbury. right age, right area. COULD this be him ??? bearing in mind the similarity between the middle names and the fact that he couldnt read or write when he married. i believe his first marriage [ as william r walker,]was in bradford in sept 1866 to nancy greenwood, she died a year later. i am totally at a loss with this man ,spent 2 hours today in local library trying to find more details of his death, the birstall ones [where i think they might be, finished november 1905 .aaaaaaaaaaagh. help and advice needed. thanks sue.