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Kate & Jess Thanks for your efforts. I think that the family in 1901 seems to be right. I'm off to bed now as well - work in the morning. I will post a message to see if some body can look at the actual marriage entry in Leyton. Living in Cornwall makes it a bit difficult. Sleep well. Pauline

Pauline - I've just looked at the image for Thomas Tyler (senior) of Leyton Essex on the 1901 census and it says 'Thomas Tyler, Head, M 46, Hostler - Licenced Victualler, Worker, Bedfordshire Luton'. 'Groom' has been written over the occupation by another hand. Now I've seen that, I think the father's occupation on the marriage cert could well be 'Hostler' although the 'o' does look rather big. My dictionary says 'hostler' is 'an ostler (now U.S.); a maintenance worker who services railway wagons, locomotives etc (US)'!!! So it really does look as though we have found the right family for May/Mary, but still we are frustratingly short of her birth details and whereabouts on the censuses! Anyway, I really must go to bed now... goodnight. Kate.

I've been looking at the wedding cert again and wonder if it could say 'bottler'. That may well fit in with the Thomas Tyler in 1901 from Luton whose occupation is given as 'Hostler - licensed victualler'. What do you think about that?

Thomas' occupation on the marriage certificate looks like 'Ostler' with a scribble before it. Drat! I was hoping it was going to be something to do with trains, which would tie in with the family we have been looking at. If you want to check what the bride's name was (i.e. Mary or May) on the original marriage cert, if you can get to Essex record office or have somebody look it up for you, it should be in the Leyton parish records as they got married at ' the parish church in the parish of Leyton' on 31st May 1898. Kate.

be careful with that one at school... 1881 again Mary Taylor abt 1868 Harrow, Middlesex, England Daughter Dulwich Comn The Chestnuts, Camberwell, London, England Mary Taylor abt 1879 Harrow Stn, Middlesex, England Son (Daughter) Peel Rd 'Royal Oak', Harrow, Middlesex, England

I wonder if May could be short for Mabel, or if Mabel could be a nickname for May??? Though if so, she would have had to have added a few years to her age when she got married. (Also, as Mabel was at home in 1891 it would mean your May Taylor at school wasn't her.) Kate.

sorry they were 1881 that same family seem to trot off to Rotherhithe in 1891 Tyler, Daisy abt 1887 Middlesex, England Daughter Rotherhithe London Tyler, Ethel M abt 1890 Middlesex, England Daughter Rotherhithe London Tyler, John abt 1877 Harrow Son Rotherhithe London Tyler, Mabel abt 1882 Harrow Daughter Rotherhithe London Tyler, Mary A abt 1850 Northampton, Northamptonshire, England Wife Rotherhithe London Tyler, Thomas abt 1854 Markyateds, Bedfordshire, England Head Rotherhithe London <TRAM DRIVER Tyler, Tom abt 1879 Harrow Son Rotherhithe London Tyler, Wallace abt 1885 Harrow Son Rotherhithe London

Oh, the Tylers at Leyton in Essex in 1901 are the same people that Jess found! I'm not sure which census she found them on, but it is interesting that they were in Leyton in 1901, isn't it? In 1891 they were in Rotherhithe in London and no daughter May or Mary with them, so presumably the one Jess found was 1881. That 'Margate St' should be Markyate, and is now in Hertfordshire but right next to the border with Bedfordshire, and the nearest big town is Luton. Kate.

Pauline - just when GR crashed I was looking at some Thomas Tylers on the 1901 at Leyton, Essex who could possibly be May's brother and father, but I haven't still got them on screen. The possible brother was born 1877 Harrow, Middlesex and living in Leyton. The possible father was born Luton, I think, and had loads of children born in various places. Anyway, I'll message you my email address so you can send me the cert and I'll try to make out his occupation for you. Kate.

Witnesses were Alice Ellen Elizabeth Horwood (Alfred's sister) and Susan Grace Horwood (Aldred's mother). I can't read Thomas Tyler's occupation. If anybody wants to send me their email address I'll scan it and send for an opinion on that. Pauline PS Think I've found her in 1891 as May Taylor, but not with family. She's at school, but the place of birth is given as Harrow which would be consistent with the 1901 census entry.

Pauline - what is Thomas Tyler's occupation on his daughter's marriage certificate, and who were the witnesses? Kate.

Address on May/Mary's wedding cert is High Road, Leyton, and on my Gran's birth cert is Beachcroft Road, Leytonstone. June, those FreeBMD entries may be promising. I looked under Hendon as she gives her place of birth as Harrow in 1901 census. Might have to squander a few pounds to send for those and see where I go. I'm waiting for Ancestry to come back on line to try 1891 census. Pauline

Thomas & Mary in the right place , no may /mary (daughter though) Mary Cook abt 1867 Bletchley, Buckinghamshire, England Step Daughter Byron Rd 2 Dales Cottges, Harrow, Middlesex, England Thomas Cook abt 1869 Crewe, Cheshire, England Step Son Byron Rd 2 Dales Cottges, Harrow, Middlesex, England Harry Tyler abt 1875 Margate St, Bedfordshire, England Son Byron Rd 2 Dales Cottges, Harrow, Middlesex, England John Tyler abt 1877 Harrow Stn, Middlesex, England Son Byron Rd 2 Dales Cottges, Harrow, Middlesex, England Mary Tyler abt 1851 Northamptonshire, England Wife Byron Rd 2 Dales Cottges, Harrow, Middlesex, England Thomas Tyler abt 1853 Margate St, Bedfordshire, England Head Byron Rd 2 Dales Cottges, Harrow, Middlesex, England Thomas Tyler abt 1879 Harrow Stn, Middlesex, England Son Byron Rd 2 Dales Cottges, Harrow, Middlesex, England Is there an address on the birth cert?

I have my Gran's birth cert and it does give her mother's name as May Tyler. Now my next question - where on 1881 census is there a May Tyler born c1879 in Harrow, Middlesex with a father Thomas Tyler? I can't find one. Perhaps I'm being blind. I've also looked on FreeBMD at Tyler births for Hendon, but no joy there either. Please help me :0)

Ooh, this is a difficult one, Pauline. One of my rellies is listed as 'May' on one census but was definitely a Mary. The other week when transcribing for FreeBMD I came across a couple of Marys in the middle of a set of Mays where they should obviously also be Mays but I guess the clerk more or less automatically wrote 'Mary' because he must have written it so many times every day. It is certainly possible that 'Mary' could be written so sloppily that the 'r' isn't obvious, but then I guess you know what your own grandmother's name was! It seems a bit more likely to me that the name on the marriage cert was written wrong, but really it could be either. If you can get your gran's birth certificate it should give her mother's name. Kate.

Hi All Details known so far as follows Her maiden name is Mary or May Tyler. Her wedding cert to Alfred Horwood in 1898 shows Mary, with father as Thomas Tyler, and her age as 19, giving a birth year of c1879. 1901 census has her listed as May, with her daughter also May born 1899 (my grandmother). Family say that my gran was named after her mother. Her birth place is given as Harrow in Middlesex. My problem lies in that I don't know if I'm looking for Mary or May. Any want to give an opinion? Pauline

NEED MORE INFO, Rosalyn

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