Find Ancestors

Last week I asked for help on the link of Emily Timons.... turned out I got the whole thing wrong way round. My mum and I got on the subject of her Mother again. I thought she had told me it was Winifred Gladys Knott that bought her up which is on her birth certificate and yet her father's marriage certificate says he was married to an Emily Timons on 26th December 1905. Turns out I completely messed up on that. Mum says it was Emily Timons who bought her up... Mum also wasn't adopted as I had thought, and like I said she had no idea about this Winifred Gladys Knott until her parents died. So I'm futher confused. Not sure what the hell I'm doing, and feel like I'm hitting a brick wall:-/ so although I very much appreciate all the info you guys have given me... can I ask if you'll take pity and sort me out further:-) By the way other Information: Emily Timons died age 69 in 1952 and Frederick Celestine Knott died 5 months later age 68 Thanks:-) Jenny

So let me see if I understand - Winifred gave birth to her, and is on the birth cert, but she was brought up by Frederick and Emily. Is her father's name on the birth cert?

Jenny Re-doing to make clearer. Jeesh I got things wrong... Can you sort me out Pls. Last week I asked for help on the link of Emily Timons.... turned out I got the whole thing wrong way round. My mum and I got on the subject of her Mother again. I thought she had told me it was Winifred Gladys Knott that bought her up which is on her birth certificate and yet her father's marriage certificate says he was married to an Emily Timons on 26th December 1905. Turns out I completely messed up on that. Mum says it was Emily Timons who bought her up... Mum also wasn't adopted as I had thought, and like I said she had no idea about this Winifred Gladys Knott until her parents died. So I'm futher confused. Not sure what the hell I'm doing, and feel like I'm hitting a brick wall:-/ so although I very much appreciate all the info you guys have given me... can I ask if you'll take pity and sort me out further:-) By the way other Information: Emily Timons died age 69 in 1952 and Frederick Celestine Knott died 5 months later age 68 Thanks:-) Jenny

Jenny When was mother born?? Victor

Hi Jenny,,, Still not sorted??? So you now have to work out who or where does Winifred fit in?????Do you think that Winifred was sister to Fred??no would have been to old,,a niece maybe???or sister in law? Kay, Emilly may have brought her up,,but her mothers maiden name was not--KNOTT, Are you sure that Fredrick and Emily were not your mothers grandparents??????

Jenny - in your previous thread you said that your mother's birth certificate gave her mother's name as Winifred Gladys Knott, formerly Haine. What does it give as the father's name? Kate.

Jenny I am sure we will try to help you, but can you please help us: Who is named on your mother's cert as her mother and father? Do they appear to be married? Was she born before/after the Timons marriage? nell

jenny, Winifred Gladys Haines was born in Hackney London 1903 March 1/4 .but registered your mums birth as Knott ,maiden name of Haine .(mistranscribed) So did she marry a Knott??? if she was married it should have *formally* Haines/Haine on your Mums birth cert and not normal practice to put Nee, So looks like your Mum was not biological daughter of Emily and Frerdrick Knott,unless Fredrick had an affair???? You may need to exclude Winifred dying in childbirth,,, kay.

If Winifred Gladys was born 1903 and Fred and Emily married 2 years after Winifred's birth, there must have been a long wait until your mother's birth? nell

Nell, Jennys Mum was born 1929, kay,

So Emily and Frederick had been married 24 years? Did they have any children of their own? nell

Hi Nell. No Jennys mum was only one,as she said on her last thread on Tips?? kay,

It looks very much as though Frederick fathered a child outside the marriage, but that his wife agreed to bring her up. nell

Hi Nell, That may well be the case,,,,but Jennys mother was registered in the name of Knott,,,,,and I belive her b/c states Winifred G Knott as mother Nee Haine,,so was she a family member???but confusing is the NEE its normal to state *fomally*, Come on Jenny we need your input on this,,,as its unfair disussing your mothers details without you,,,,, Kay,

I remember trying to sort out this family last week. Could it be that Winifred Gladys Knott was Frederick and Ellen's daughter-in-law and her husband died (so your mum never knew about him) and Frederick and Ellen brought up your mum themselves. If Frederick and Ellen married in 1905 and your mother wasn't born until 1929, they are much more likely to be her grandparents rather than parents, although it wouldn't be impossible for them to be parents. (p.s. have looked for deaths of a Knott in the Bakewell district in the 9 months before your mother's birth but can't find one, so that might shoot down my theory. Perhaps Winifred was ahead of her time and became a 'surrogate' mother. If Frederick went with her to register the birth, then no one would question whether they were actually married and she could register the child in his name, even if they weren't married, but then Frederick would have to be named on the birth certificate as father.) Kath. x

Last week Jenny posted her thread just before 9a.m.(like today) and came back to it after 5p.m., so perhaps she is working during the day and will get back to us later. Kath. x

Hi Kath, That is my feeling that they were her Grandparents,,, Looks like Jenny has some,,searching to do,,,, Jenny any name of the father on on your mums birthcet? Kay,

Just to say thanks guys for all the help and patience you have given. I know that I've possibly caused a few headaches on this subject, but I appreciate everyones support and help on my lack of intelligence:-0 You'll probably all be relieved to know that I have been asked by my support worker if I want to do a one day geneaology course as she knows that I am very interested in building my roots.....I think judging by my lack of brain cells I'm going to take up the offer, so hopefully, fingers crossed I'll be on the ball just like all of you:-)

Jenny, Dont be fooled for a minute:) as your is modern day its easier to sort out,,,,,,,and most of us have a few years under our belts,,me 17years and still no expert by long way,,,,but sure every one is glad of your praise,,,and hey we all started some where and made loads of mistakes along the way,,all of us, One day course will show you the first basic steps,,,,,,,, kay,

Sorry I have to go off-line for now... either be back later or tomorrow. Cheers for the messages so far, you've all been a great help :-)