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Does anyone have access to waterman record? I am looking for William James Bateman from Deptford area. The only info I have of him is his son's marriage cert (St John's 1859) which states father's occupation Waterman. I estimate son's birth as around 1836 Southwark. I can only guess William birth year 1816? Any help much appreciated, Selena

Sorry, Ive looked through my disc for bindings 1692-1949 and though a fair number of Batemens listed on apprenticeships not a Wiliam James. You could try looking at Dockland Ancestors site for assistance?

Selena Have tried www.parishregisters(.)com ? It is a brilliant site for the history and has a searchable database for Water and Lightermen. Its not yet complete but is growing fast. Good luck Chris

That is the same site as Dockland Ancestors!

What is his son's name and age on marriage cert???

Or this guy, in Bromley, a stones throw from Deptford? I guess we really want to know the sons name to have a good search. Caroline Mary Bateman abt 1801 Bromley, Kent, England Wife Bromley Kent View Record George Bateman abt 1813 Bromley, Kent, England Brother Bromley Kent View Record William Bateman abt 1805 Netheravon, Wiltshire, England Head Bromley Kent View Record William James Bateman abt 1832 Bromley, Kent, England Son Bromley Kent

Thank you all so much!!! I thought I wouldn't get any response at all. Sorry I didn't come back earlier - was walking the dog. Son's name was also William James Bateman (labourer) full age at marriage in 1859. Son on 61 census states born Southwark, Bricklayers labourer (age unreadable 20's). Son died in 1871 aged 35, so estimate son's birth at 1835 ish. If I don't reply straight away, I have just gone to get girls from school, Thanks so much, Selena

Heather, what year were those census records for? There is a Bromley connection (William senior's grandson married a girl in Bromley and moved there later in 1880's). As I said, I have William junior on the 1861 with wife and child in Deptford. Thanks Selena

Sorry, I could have sworn I said - its 1851. They are living in the High Street and dad is a plumber/glazier and painter (man of many talents eh?). I was just thinking - as you do - just because it says of full age on the marriage certificate, the son could well be more mature than you imagine! Ive had 50 year olds described of full age. I think we need to try and find his birth somehow as it could lead us astray. What is the brides name - can we gauge (I know its not foolproof) what age the groom may be from that? Oh, you have him on a census, so you know the birth year is about 1836 then?

What about this baptism? WILLIAM BATEMAN Male -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Event(s): Birth: Christening: 16 JUL 1837 Saint John Horseleydowns, Bermondsey, London, England Death: Burial: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Parents: Father: WILLIAM BATEMAN Family Mother: RACHEL -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Messages: Extracted birth or christening record for locality listed in the record. The source records are usually arranged chronologically by the birth or christening date. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Source Information: Batch No.: Dates: Source Call No.: Type: Printout Call No.: Type: P015521 1803 - 1853 0254540-0254544 Film 0821146 Film P015521 1803 - 1853 0254540-0254544 Film NONE Sheet: 00

Was the father alive do you know when the boy married? Who were the witnesses on the cert? Theres this lot in the right place: View Record Ann Bateman abt 1848 St George Daughter Lewisham Kent View Record Jane Bateman abt 1811 St Oliver, Surrey, England Head Lewisham Kent View Record Maria Bateman abt 1843 St Oliver Daughter Lewisham Kent View Record William Bateman abt 1836 St Oliver Son Lewisham Kent I think its should read St Olaves, Rotherhithe (Southwark)

Thanks Heather, this family have been very difficult. I was hoping that being a waterman might help me a bit. On son's marriage cert, it doesn't say father 'deceased'but I'm not going to go by that for definate. Witnesses in 1859 marriage were Richard and Jane Ranoe. Jane Ranoe was the informant on William (son) death in 1871. I have never been able to find a family link (although Jane and Richard don't seem to have been married till 1876). I'm just so frustrated I can't find anything definate earlier than 1859. About the latest entry for Lewisham, was that an 1851? And I've never heard of St Oliver's and I've lived in Lewisham all my life (and I work for Lewisham Council (lol). Just don't quite know what to do next Selena

Sorry Heather, missed the last bit. Now I very much like St Olaves as I have loads from Rotherhithe!. So I now need to find a marriage for William James Bateman to Jane somebody. Or a marriage of William to Rachel. And I need to try and find the family in 41? Just thinking aloud here. Can I have the address for the Lewisham people please Selena

It was the 1851 aswell and GUESS WHAT WOO HOO! The next door neighbours are the Rances! (aka the Ranoes!) I think we have cracked it!!!

HEATHER, HEATHER, HEATHER, I'm so excited!!!! but I have to dish up the girls dinner. Don't go away please! I NEED THAT IMAGE! Triple blessings to you!!!! Selena

Ok, I saved the image, have to go now, but be back later if you send me your email addy I will mail it to you. The Rances are Richard, 26 and a labourer, living with mum Sarah aged 62. Richard is Deaf. AND so is WILLIAM, your boy! I wonder if there is a family connection there and if Richards mum is perhaps your guys auntie? Here is the ref for the page: Name: Jane Bateman Age: 40 Estimated birth year: abt 1811 Relation: Head Household: View other family members Gender: Female Where born: St Oliver, Surrey, England Civil parish: Lewisham County/Island: Kent Country: England Street address: View image Condition as to marriage: View image Occupation: View image Disability: View image Source information: HO107/1591 Registration district: Lewisham Sub-registration district: Lee ED, institution, or vessel: 3d Folio: 245 Page: 17 (click to see others on page) Household schedule number: 87 GSU Number: 174828 I know St Olaves well, all my lot are from Rotherhithe area, thats how I recognised it!! I think you may find the son upgraded dads job a bit on the certificate. He may well have been a watermans labourer but not served an apprenticeship. I know that from my lot and I have dozens of watermen and lightermen but you get the occasional one who doesnt appear in the apprenticeships. Be back soon.

Heather this is so wonderful, such a breakthrough for me. I will PM my email address now. I remember some of your threads on Rotherhithe. I have Mills and Poole ancestors from there who were watermen. My mum was born and lived in Rotherhithe during the blitz. I will definately let you know if I ever manage a trip to Rotherhithe records (in between work, kids and moving house). Thank you so much, Selena

Ive mailed the image. Interesting both boys are deaf. I would definitely look to see if there is a family connection between the Rances and the Batemans. Seems too much of a coincidence. Yes, Id be grateful if you do get a chance to get to the Southwark archives as they have a lot of records which I would dearly like to try and find dads lot in. My nan was a fire officer in Rotherhithe/Bermondsey during the blitz. No doubt they probably did know of one another as that was a very close knit community then