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Any thoughts on the info I posted at 15.37 yesterday?



Thomas C Gratton married HARVEY in Leek in 1937. He is in LEEK in 1939. He was born in 1910 and died in 1967. He was NOT Colclough’s husband

When you get the CORRECT 1937 marriage certificate, you will - hopefully - know who Thomas Gratton's father was

Morning,

How is everybody.

I have been looking at Edith May Colclough 14th August 1912-1980
l think she married

Thomas Chilton Gratton 1937-1967 following him on the cenes is parents are

Thomas Edwin Gratton 1885
Mary Ellen Ryles 1884

I am going to order there marriage certificate to just double check l have the right parents.

thanks

Amanda

For INFO

Births Dec 1918 (>99%)
Chambers James Colclough Stoke T. 6b 337

Deaths Dec 1919 (>99%)
Chambers James 1 Stoke T. 6b 242

Your Ancestry tree has WRONG info..................

You've used the record below, :-S :-S :-S :-S :-S

..........don't know why you thought it was YOUR man

Deaths 1991 (52%)
GRATTON GRAHAM 11MY1960 EAST STAFFS 30 558

This is the CORRECT record................

GRATTON, GRAHAM THOMAS 1943
GRO Reference: DOR Q1/2021 in STAFFORDSHIRE (738-1A) Entry Number 521763728

Helpful, I hope………………..

Re Thomas Gratton -
you definitely need the marriage cert, for his father's name.

Even though the 1939 Register gives his DOB as 7 Dec 1901, the Register isn't always correct.

The only birth registration of a Thomas Gratton in England or Wales which fits with that DOB is this one below - BUT that's NOT him. That man lived, married, and died in Cheshire.
I'm only posting it to let you know that he's NOT Edith's husband!

GRATTON, THOMAS ENOCH mmn DWYER
GRO Reference: 1902 M Quarter in BIRKENHEAD Volume 08A Page 506


There is also no death in England or Wales for a Thomas Gratton (or Grattan) born in 1901-2

Hopefully this is useful.....

UK, WWI, Pension Ledgers and Index Cards, 1914-1923

Full Name Chambers, Thomas
Service Number 29129
Rank Pte
Regiment 8th North Staffs

Relative 1
Chambers, A
Relative Residence Address Stoke-on-Trent Staffs
Relative 1 Relation To Head Widow
Relative 1 Birth Date 1 Apr 1881

He attested August 1 1916 in Lichfield aged 36 years 2 months
NOK Ann, 8 Peel Street, Stoke on Trent
Home - 6/2/1915 - 8/12/1916


Relative 2
Colclough, Ann Jane
Relative 2 Relation to Head Child
Relative 2 Birth Date 10 Aug 1905

Relative 3
Colclough, Edith may
Relative 3 Relation to Head Children
Relative 3 Birth Date 14 Aug 1912

Relative 4 Chambers, Thomas
Relative 3 Relation to Head Children
Relative 4 Birth Date 29 Dec 1915

Relative 5 Chambers, Jem
Relative 5 Relation to Head Children
Relative 5 Birth Date 12 Dec 1918

1914 - 1926
Reference Number 042/0168/CHA-CHA
Document Number 6/APW/352
Archive Location London, England
Archive Name Western Front Association
Conflict Period World War I
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Extract from War Diary 8th Battalion, North Staffordshire Regiment,

29 May- Field- Bn (Battalion) arrived at farm N of Chambrecy about 12 noon. Received
instructions to take up positions on ridge N of Mery-Premacy. Situation very
quiet during the night.

30 May- The enemy attacked and we had to fall back slightly. The following officers
were wounded........

No mention of any OR (other ranks) killed or wounded.

According to the CWGC (Commonweath War Graves Commission) Thomas is buried or commemorated at
SOISSONS MEMORIAL, France

The UK, British Army Registers of Soldiers' Effects, 1901-1929 register lists Thomas as
"Death Presumed" which means ,name on a memorial and no known grave.

and from the book
History of the 8th North Staffords [1921, British Army] by F Crewe

"At midnight on the 28th of May a fleet of French lorries arrive, we are “embussed,” and we depart for “Goodness knows where!” All night long we travel, with only occasional stops when blocks occur on the road, and daylight reveals the fact that we are travelling in the direction of EPERNAY. We try to appreciate the situation. The enemy has broken through near RHEIMS or SOISSONS we guess. As the morning progresses we meet lots of French civilians escaping to the rear with their worldly possessions on their backs, or on waggons and carts of all sorts, piled up with bedding, with the inevitable old woman and young child surmounting the lot. Occasionally we pass a lorry in the ditch by the roadside, which tells a story of a driver caught snatching forty winks. Later in the morning we pass through EPERNAY, and leaving the road to RHEIMS on our right we pass through the forest of RHEIMS, and eventually halt near CHAMBRECY about 12 noon, where we “ de-bus,” and after a few hasty verbal instructions we take up position on the ridge near by. As the day progresses intelligence regarding the situation is obtained, and a serious gap in the line is located and filled, and the best strategic positions taken up.

We did not become seriously engaged with the enemy on the 29th, although we were in close touch with him. We were attacked on the moming of the 30th on our front and flanks, which were both entirely uncovered, and under the weight of numbers were compelled to give ground slightly, not, however, without inflicting severe loss on the enemy.. Our own losses were also severe, and included five Officers wounded, one of whom was the Commanding Officer Lt.-Colonel Dakeyne, D.S.O. The loss of the C.O. was a severe blow, but with Major Martin available to take command the loss was greatly neutralised. Operations during the next few days took the form of artillery duels, during which a fair number of casualties were incurred, including 2nd Lieuts. Brockhurst and Newham, wounded. This was the situation on the 6th when the enemy made a determined attack on our position, which is described by an eye-witness, one of the few surviving Officers, of the battle."

2 separate extracts- a War Diary and a book, professing "our own losses were also severe", but both writers still had the time to NOT mention how many Other Ranks were killed or injured !!

From ANCESTRY....where you have a tree!

Name Edith May Colclough
Birth Date 14 Aug 1912
Relation to Soldier Child
Title WWI Pension Record Cards and Ledgers
Description Other Ranks Died Chambers Ja-Channings Wh
Next of Kin (Name) Relation to Soldier
Thomas Chambers
A Chambers
Widow
Ann Jane Colclough
Child
Edith May Colclough Child
Thomas Chambers
Child
Jem Chambers*********James
Child

County borders can also change. When using FreeBMD enter a range of at least a year either side of the one you think it is- you can also click on the district names to find the places that district covered.

Look at the date of birth.............then remember that parents had 6 weeks to register the birth........

Get copy marriage cert for name of his father - if he knew him

Don't assume he was born in Stafforshire..............be open-minded

He may also not have known when he was actually born.........the marriage cert is by far the most useful and sensible option

Hi,

I cant find a birth record for Thomas Gratton born 1901 can anyone help me with this please.

thanks

Amanda

Same general area….check on any map………..people move house

I’ve nudged up your Johnson thread……..please look at it and add a response

Hi,

Thank you for the information, I ask for help because l am not as good as some people are at genealogy.

So Edith married a Thomas Gratton born 1901

I did a search on Staffordshire BMD and found the following.

Graham Thomas 1943 in District of stoke
Lillian 1943 in the district of Burslem

there was also another child John Anthony 1955

am l on the right track and why would there be 2 different districts.

thanks

Amanda

The woman who married Drew was born 1921...maiden name Barlow

Paper trail to prove not relevant to this enquiry........easy to find

Marriages Sep 1942 (>99%)
Barlow Edith M Colclough Stoke 6b 316
Colclough Frederick Barlow Stoke 6b 316

Marriages Dec 1960 (>99%)
Drew Edith M Muller Stoke 9b 1261
MULLER Adam DREW Stoke 9b 1261

Name Edith M Muller
Maiden Name Barlow
Gender Female
Record Type Death
Death Date 21 Feb 1997
Death Place Staffordshire, England

Name Edith May Muller
Death Age 75
Birth Date 8 Jun 1921
Registration Date Feb 1997
Registration District Stafford
Inferred County Staffordshire
Register Number S52D
District and Subdistrict 7352
Entry Number 21

1939 Register
328 London Road, Stoke-On-Trent, Stoke-On-Trent C.B., Staffordshire, England
Thomas Gratton 07 Dec 1901 Male General Labourer (Steel Rolling Mill) Married 23 1
Edith M Gratton 14 Aug 1912 Female Unpaid Domestic Duties Married 23 2

Now look YOURSELF for children of the marriage.......................

Good advice AG. I always think that one should track others findings. You now know it is there and finding it helps you learn to navigate the sites.

I should leave you to look it up for yourself, to give you practice, Amanda - and in fact, please do look it up for that reason. It's also much more satisfying to find answers yourself!

However -

Middle names aren't given in full in the search results for some years on FreeBMD.

Two possible marriages:

Marriages Sep 1937 (>99%)
COLCLOUGH Edith M Gratton Stoke 6b 627
GRATTON Thomas Colclough Stoke 6b 627

Marriages Sep 1955 (>99%)
COLCLOUGH Edith M DREW Stoke 9b 1523
DREW Colin COLCLOUGH Stoke 9b 1523


It looks as if the 1937 marriage may be the correct one:

Deaths Jun 1980 (>99%)
GRATTON EDITH MAY 14AU1912 STOKE/T 30 1649

Do you know Edith's exact DOB?

For England and Wales look it up on www.freebmd.org.uk

Morning everyone,

Hope you are all ok ?

Would there be any way of finding out if Edith May Colclough 1912 married at all ?

thanks

Amanda

Lydia Allen
in the Staffordshire, England, Church of England Marriages and Banns, 1754-1900
Name Lydia Allen
Marriage Age Full age
Record Type Marriage
Residence Place Knutton Heath
Marriage Date 6 Nov 1843
Marriage Place Wolstanton, St Margaret, Staffordshire, England
Father James Allen
Spouse George Taylor
Religion Anglican
Page number 75

Half-siblings (Lydia's children):

SIMPSON, HANNAH mmn ALLEN
GRO Reference: 1851 D Quarter in STOKE UPON TRENT Volume 17 Page 152

SIMPSON, ELLEN mmn ALLEN
GRO Reference: 1855 J Quarter in STOKE UPON TRENT Volume 06B Page 186

SIMPSON, ARTHUR mmn ALLEN
GRO Reference: 1860 S Quarter in STOKE UPON TRENT Volume 06B Page 187

SIMPSON, JAMES mmn ALLEN
GRO Reference: 1864 J Quarter in STOKE UPON TRENT Volume 06B Page 215


But one has mmn given as Taylor (Lydia's presumably previous married surname):

SIMPSON, SARAH mmn TAYLOR
GRO Reference: 1866 S Quarter in STOKE UPON TRENT Volume 06B Page 161


But the name Platt appears, too, for some reason:

SIMPSON, ANNIE ELIZA mmn PLATT
GRO Reference: 1857 S Quarter in STOKE UPON TRENT Volume 06B Page 176


Ellen Platt Simpson
in the England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name Ellen Platt Simpson
Gender Female
Baptism Date 5 Aug 1855
Baptism Place Fenton, Stafford, England
Father Richard Simpson
Mother Lydia
FHL Film Number 1470947