Find Ancestors

Amazing thank you

Strange that Elizabeth Baines' father is recorded as William Pemberton .....
when that's where the marriage took place !.

But we need details from 1909 marr first before assuming these are your folks:

Marriage: 20 May 1882 St John the Divine, Pemberton, Lancashire, England
William Belshaw - 23 Collier Bachelor of Newtown, Pemberton
Elizabeth Baines - 22 Weaver in Cotton Mill Spinster of Newtown, Pemberton
Groom's Father: John Belshaw, Collier
Bride's Father: William Pemberton, (deceased)
Witness: Peter Leigh, (X); Mary Jane Worsley, (X)
Married by Banns by: Harry Mitchell, Vicar
Register: Marriages 1878 - 1885, Page 133, Entry 265
Source: LDS Film 1885637

William gives Newtown as his birthplace, which would come under Pemberton.

MAYBE this is his birth with mother's maiden name Baynes

PLEASE CHECK OUT his marriage cert to Eliza for father's name before assuming this is him

Lancashire Birth indexes for the years: 1887
BELSHAW William - Pemberton - Wigan & Leigh - BAYNES

------------------------------------------------

POSSIBLE parents for the above birth

Lancashire Marriage indexes for the years: 1882
BELSHAW William - BAINES Elizabeth -
St. John, Pemberton Wigan & Leigh

Using http://www.lancashirebmd.org.uk/

Lancashire Birth indexes for the years:
Surname Forename(s) Sub-District Registers At Mother's Maiden Name Reference
1911 BELSHAW William Leslie Pemberton Wigan & Leigh SOUTHERN PEM/104/416
1915 BELSHAW Clifford Wigan Wigan & Leigh SOUTHERN WIG/280/337
1917 BELSHAW Jack Hindley Wigan & Leigh HNDL/200/484
1923 BELSHAW James Arthur Hindley Wigan & Leigh HNDL/216/331
1923 BELSHAW Frank Hindley Wigan & Leigh HNDL/216/332



Using http://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl

Births Mar 1915 (>99%)
BELSHAW Clifford Southern Wigan 8c 93

Births Sep 1917 (>99%)
Belshaw Jack Southern Wigan 8c 169

Births Sep 1923 (>99%)
Belshaw Frank Southern Wigan 8c 72
Belshaw James A Southern Wigan 8c 72


http://www.lan-opc.org.uk/indexp.html doesn't go far enough for the 1909 marr - you could email the OPC and ask for a transcription.

1871 England Census
about Jane Winnard
Name: Jane Winnard
Age: 18
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1853
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Edward Winnard
Mother's name: Jane Winnard
Gender: Female
Where born: Wigan, Lancashire, England
Civil parish: Wigan
Ecclesiastical parish: All Saints
Town: Wigan
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Registration district: Wigan
Sub-registration district: Wigan
ED, institution, or vessel: 35
Household schedule number: 19
Piece: 3889
Folio: 5
Page Number: 4
Household Members: Name Age
Edward Winnard 75 (Carter)
Jane Winnard 60
Alice Winnard 21
Jane Winnard 18
John Taylor 24 (Lodger)
William Taylor 20 (Lodger)


1861 England Census
about Jane Winnard
Name: Jane Winnard
Age: 6
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1855
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Edward Winnard
Mother's name: Jane Winnard
Gender: Female
Where born: Wigan, Lancashire, England

Civil parish: Wigan
Ecclesiastical parish: All Saints
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage: View image

Registration district: Wigan
Sub-registration district: Wigan
ED, institution, or vessel: 32
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 19
Piece: 2777
Folio: 2
Page Number: 3
Household Members: Name Age
Edward Winnard 46
Jane Winnard 50
Charles Winnard 17
James Winnard 13
Alice Winnard 9
Jane Winnard 6
Arthur Robinson 18 (Lodger)

Eliza's parents and siblings in 1881

Household: 1881

James SOUTHERN Head M Male 36 Astley, Lancashire, England Iron Dresser
Jane SOUTHERN Wife M Female 27 Wigan, Lancashire, England Cotton Winder In Factory
Alice SOUTHERN Daur U Female 7 Wigan, Lancashire, England Scholar
John W. SOUTHERN Son Male 5 Wigan, Lancashire, England Scholar
Mary SOUTHERN Daur Female 3 Wigan, Lancashire, England Scholar
Sarah J. SOUTHERN Daur Female 1 Wigan, Lancashire, England

:
Dwelling 10 Lord St
Census Place Wigan, Lancashire, England

1911 census posted at 11:47

Household transcription
1911 census

Person: SOUTHERN, Jane
Address: 32 Wallace Lane Wigan

SOUTHERN, Jane Head Widow F 57 1854 Lancs Wigan VIEW
SOUTHERN, Charles Son Single M 26 1885 Railway Labourer Lancs Wigan VIEW
SOUTHERN, Thomas Son Single M 20 1891 Baker Bread Lancs Wigan VIEW
SOUTHERN, James Son Single M 16 1895 Pit Brow Hand Colliers-Labourer Above Ground Coal Mine Lancs Wigan VIEW
SOUTHERN, Louisa Daughter Single F 22 1889 Factory Realer Machine Cotton Reeler Lancs Wigan VIEW
SOUTHERN, Annie Daughter Single F 15 1896 Lancs Wigan VIEW
HOLLAND, Robert Boarder Widower M 36 1875 Railway Platelayer Lancs Wigan VIEW
HOLLAND, James Son M 11 1900 Lancs Wigan VIEW
RG number: RG14
Piece: 22978
Reference: RG14PN22978 RG78PN1345 RD458 SD3 ED6 SN83
Registration District: Wigan
Sub District: Wigan
Enumeration District: 6
Parish: Wigan
Address: 32 Wallace Lane Wigan
County: Lancashire
(12 children born, 10 living,2 had died)


Husband's death..

.Deaths Dec 1897 (>99%)
Southern James 51 Wigan 8c 44

Baptisms: 21 Mar 1887 All Saints, Wigan, Lancashire, England
Eliza Southern - Child of James Southern & Jane
Born: 23 Jan
Abode: 20 Lord St.
Occupation: Iron dresser
Baptised by: H. F. Lloyd Curate


---------------------------------------------------------

Marriage: 9 Feb 1874 All Saints, Wigan, Lancashire, England
James Southern - 27 Iron Dresser Bachelor of Lord St.
Jane Winnard - (X), 20 Winder Spinster of Lord St.
Groom's Father: William Southern, (decd.), Overlooker
Bride's Father: Edward Winnard, (decd.), Coachman
Witness: James Winnard; Ann Winnard, (X)
Married by Banns by: George A. E. Kempson Curate

PM received

My Father jack belshaw was born in Wigan 5/9/17 I would like to search further back to my grandfathers records he was william year of birth unknown this is my first attempt at the family tree.
Kind regards Glenys


-------------------------------
Is this your father ?

Births Sep 1917
Belshaw Jack - mother's maiden name Southern - Wigan 8c 169


Marriage Sept Quarter 1909 - reference number Wigan 8c 153
BELSHAW William - SOUTHERN Eliza
St. George, Wigan Wigan & Leigh


From freebmd - other children born to this couple
( there may be others but the maiden name is only available for births after 1911)


Births Mar 1915
BELSHAW Clifford - Southern - Wigan 8c 93


and twins

Births Sep 1923
Belshaw Frank -Southern -Wigan 8c 72
Belshaw James A -Southern - Wigan 8c 72


You can buy certificates from the General Registry office ( £9.25 each )
here's the link
http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/Login.asp


The marriage certificate should give you the couple's ages and fathers names.

You should look for William and Eliza on the 1911 census, which would give their ages and birthplaces.

Another Balshaw/Southern sibling...

Births Mar 1915 (>99%)]
BELSHAW Clifford Southern Wigan 8c 93

This MAY be Eliza in 1901 - the Parish matches that in which she married


Name: Eliza Southern
Age: 14
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1887
Relation: Daughter
Mother's name: Jane Southern
Gender: Female
Where born: Wigan, Lancashire, England
Civil parish: Wigan
Ecclesiastical parish: St George
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Registration district: Wigan
Sub-registration district: Wigan
ED, institution, or vessel: 4
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 13
Piece: 3552
Folio: 81
Page Number: 2
Household Members:
Name Age
Jane Southern 47
Alice Southern 26
John W Southern 25
Mary Southern 23
Charles Southern 15
Eliza Southern 14
Louisa Southern 11
Thomas Southern 10
James Southern 6
Eva A Southern 4


Same family in 1891


Name: Eliza Southern
Age: 4
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1887
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: James Southern
Mother's name: Jane Southern
Gender: Female
Where born: Wigan, Lancashire, England
Civil parish: Wigan
Ecclesiastical parish: St Michael
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Registration district: Wigan
Sub-registration district: Wigan
ED, institution, or vessel: 41
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 3055
Folio: 60
Page Number: 21
Household Members:
Name Age
James Southern 47 Occ: Iron Dresser - born ASTLEY
Jane Southern 37
Alice Southern 17
William Southern 15
Mary Southern 14
Sarah J Southern 12
Edward Southern 8
Charles Southern 6
Eliza Southern 4
Louisa Southern 1

Too many possible births for Eliza to give info with any degree of certainty

The cert is essential for fathers' details - for both of them, as there are two possible births for William

1911 census

Person: BELSHAW, William Address: 5 Victoria St Newtown
Cost


BELSHAW, William Head Married M 23 1888 Colliery Trammer Below Ground Newtown Wigan Lanc VIEW
BELSHAW, Eliza Wife Married 1 year 9 months F 24 1887 Wigan Lanc VIEW
BELSHAW, William Leslie Son M 0 (1 MONTH) 1911 Newtown Wigan Lanc VIEW

Lancashire Marriage indexes for the years: 1909
Surname Forename(s) Surname Forename(s) Church / Register Office Registers At Reference
BELSHAW William SOUTHERN Eliza St. George, Wigan Wigan & Leigh C30/10/57

Hi again My father was Jack Belshaw born 1917 I wish to look further back to William who was his father and also by remarkable coincidence My good friend and colleague was lookng through her Mothers history and found a Belshaw family connection so we are really wanting to see what it is.
many thanks again

You are welcome Franbell.

If you get stuck - come back on here and post some details of who you are looking for and we will try to 'start you off'

Dea x

Thank you for your replies I am grateful I will follow your suggestions

You might check out:
http://www.lancashirebmd.org.uk/
http://www.wiganworld.co.uk/stuff/cemetery.php?opt=cemetery