Find Ancestors

I am new to trying to trace my family tree, and haven't got too far back before encountering a few issues which I would welcome any advice on from members of the forum....

First of all I have come across that my great grans maiden name is infact my current family name - in that it seems her daughter (my nan) married her cousin or something similar - something which I would like to explore further.

However I am having difficulty in finding this particular strain of the family through the records avaliable.
In relation to my grandad (long deceased) I have his mothers maiden name which I was hoping searching marriage records between my family surmame and the maiden name to trace the family back further, however both seem very common around the time period (and also I don't have any idea of the exact marriage date just that it was pre 1933) so apart from searching through the thousands of marriage records I don't really know where to begin with this.

Secondly tracing my family name back is harder still as my great gran (who I have all her information for - DOB/Death and marriage etc) however when searching the 1911 census (at which point she would have been 3) pulls up only 1 result - which is not my great gran as it has the wrong middle name.

Sorry It's all a bit confusing at the moment but I would appreciate any help if possible.... :-S

Which records are you using for your research?

I hope that you are not using GR..............

To give us a chance to kickstart your research, tell us the full name, birth year and birthplace of the person you are trying to find in1911.

Perhaps some details would help us to help you

Have sent a pm to Charlotte in case she doesn't know how to reply.

Apologies - been trying to post whilst on lunch break at work but the site keeps going down now and again. Will post all the info this evening.

Thanks :-)

My Great Gran was a Violet (on some records listed Ethel as middle name) Painter (maiden) and Hamilton (married). Born 10th May 1909 in West Ham. I would assume she would appear on the 1911 cenus but alas not.

My granddad (who I assume was great grans nephew or similar?) was an Albert R Painter. Born 1933 in Greenwich. His mothers maiden name was Luck.

The whole family that Ive managed to trace back so far have been from around the London area.

Thanks

Births Jun 1909 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Painter Violet Ethel W. Ham 4a 498




1911


PAINTER, Charles William Head Married
18 years M 36 1875 Market Porter St Lukes London VIEW
PAINTER, Caroline Wife Married F 36 1875 Islington London VIEW
PAINTER, Caroline Louisa Daughter Single F 17 1894 Domestic Servant Hoxton London VIEW
PAINTER, John Edwward Son M 14 1897 Warehouse Boy St Lukes London VIEW
PAINTER, Florence Emma Daughter F 11 1900 School Hoxton London VIEW
PAINTER, Charles Richard Son M 10 1901 School Walthamstow Essex VIEW
PAINTER, Elizabeth Rebbeca Daughter F 8 1903 Walthamstow Essex VIEW
PAINTER, Helen May Daughter F 6 1905 Walthamstow Essex VIEW
PAINTER, Arthur Henry Son M 3 1908 Walthamstow Essex VIEW
>>>>>PAINTER, Voilet Ethel Daughter F 1 1910 Walthamstow Essex VIEW

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RG number:
RG14 Piece:
9735 Reference:
RG14PN9735 RG78PN514B RD188 SD10 ED61 SN307

Registration District:
West Ham Sub District:
Walthamstow Enumeration District:
61 Parish:
Walthamstow

Address:
6 Garner Road Fulbourn Road Walthamstow County:
Essex

If as you say , you already have your gt nan's DOB, why did you think she would be 3 yrs old in April 1911 ?

Name: Charles William Mole Painter
Age: 22
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1873
Spouse Name: Caroline Cooper
Spouse Age: 21
Record Type: Marriage
Marriage Date: 19 May 1895
Parish: St Paul, Clerkenwell
County: London
Borough: Islington
Father Name: William Painter
Spouse Father Name: Richard Cooper
____________________________________________________


1901

Name: Caroline Painter
Age: 25
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1876
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: Charles W Painter
Gender: Female
Where born: Islington, London, England

Civil parish: Walthamstow
Ecclesiastical parish: Walthamstow
County/Island: Essex
Country: England

Registration district: West Ham
Sub-registration district: Walthamstow
ED, institution, or vessel: 51
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 111
Piece: 1630
Folio: 119
Page Number: 19
Household Members: Name Age
Charles W Painter 25
Caroline Painter 25
Caroline L Painter 7
John C Painter 4
Florence E Painter 1
Charles W Painter 3
Henry Cooper 23 BROTHER IN LAW
Ellen Pullen 25
James Pullen 3

I can't work out why you thought Violet would have been 3 years old on 2nd April 1911

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Marriages Mar 1925 --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Luck Helen A - Painter - St. Olave 1d 207
Painter Charles W - Luck - St.Olave 1d 207

Possible birth

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Births Mar 1909
LUCK Helen - Barnet 3a 392

Hi Charlotte
There are photographs of Violets parents on a tree on Ancestry
If you would like a copies, send me your e-mail address by PM and I'll get them to you

Albert Painter (1933 ) had at least five siblings.

Their birth registrations can esily be found on freebmd..............

http://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl

Use the site to find any BMD info between 1837 and approx 1950

This seems to suggest that brother and sister married sister and brother


Marriages Mar 1925 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Luck Helen A Painter St. Olave 1d 207
Painter Charles W Luck St.Olave 1d 207
_______________________________________________________


Marriages Sep 1916 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Luck Williams Painter St.Olave 1d 360
Painter Caroline L Luck St.Olave 1d 360

CHILDREN

Births Mar 1918 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Luck Florence E C Painter St.Olave 1d 283

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Births Mar 1920 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Luck William C E Painter St.Olave 1d 546

???????

Name: Helen A Painter
Birth Date: abt 1901
Date of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec 1968
Age at Death: 67
Registration district: Winchester
Inferred County: Hampshire
Volume: 6b
Page: 837


There is no birth to equate exactly to this death, however, there is one for an ELLEN Alice Luck which MAY be hers.

The cert of her marriage to Painter will name her father..........you can then cross-refer with details from 1911 census.............below

1911 Census - household transcription
Person: LUCK, Helen
Address: 39 Banning St East Greenwich SE
LUCK, William Head Married M 38 1873 Stoker Electrical Trams St Albans Herts VIEW
LUCK, Eliza Wife Married
15 years F 35 1876 Farley Green Surrey VIEW
LUCK, William Son M 14 1897 Chelsea London VIEW
LUCK, Frederick Son M 12 1899 School Newsboy Battersea London VIEW
LUCK, Helen Daughter F 9 1902 Balham London VIEW
LUCK, Charles Son M 8 1903 Tooting London VIEW
LUCK, George Son M 4 1907 Greenwich London VIEW
LUCK, Ada Daughter F 1 1910 Greenwich London VIEW
PALLETT, Albert Boarder Single M 24 1887 Stoker Electric Trams Dartford Kent VIEW

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RG number:
RG14 Piece:
2691 Reference:
RG14PN2691 RG78PN92 RD28 SD5 ED5 SN143

Thanks for everyones help

In regards to the age of my great gran - that was a typo and meant to say 2 (forgot what time of the year the census would of been taken so she was actually only 11 months I assume in reality)

Im trying to make sence of the info given above by everyone - thank you very much everyone...

I think Im getting somewhere now - no idea why I couldn't find some of the information on here before :-S but thank you everyone for pointing me in the right direction. At least it seems now that Im closer to finding out the two sides of the family were related

In regards to the post above this one for Helen Alice Painter (luck) - I seem to have found a second possible death which would match her birth as 1902 - died 1986 in Surrey.....

However - does anyone have any ideas how I can further go about trying to trace albert's parents as Im stuck for ideas on how to find out which member of the Luck and Painter was in fact his mother + father without obtaining his original birth cert? Im sure its probably obvious.... :-S

With regard to Helen's death..............her age in 1911 was 9...................so she had to have been born before 2nd April, 1902

Is THIS the record to which you refer?

Name: Alice Helen Painter
Birth Date: 1902
Date of Registration: Aug 1986
Age at Death: 84
Registration district: Surrey South-Western
Inferred County: Surrey
Volume: 17
Page: 1254

Why are you querying Albert's parentage?

There is only ONE marriage of a male Painter to a female Luck on freebmd, which has been posted above.

Yes sorry - just realised Id missed that one above having a slightly stupid moment when I posted that! :-S