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Jax,
Where die you get the army records from? It says there are 10 images for him, would love to see them.

Julie

Yes your right there probably is no connection. It would be nice if I could find out exactly how they came to have her. If only they would have talked about it at the time, but in those days they didn't.

There could quite possibly be no connection at all. Maybe the father was left with the baby and they just took her in as thier own? It looks like your gt grandparents had a large house with 11 rooms

jax

It is the connection with the Duffins that I really want to know. The Duffins were my Great Grandparents, they wouldn't talk about who Florence was all they would say was they just took to her!
The Duffins were farmers and lived in Leicestershire in 1909 at the time of Florences birth. They also called her Poppy.

Nor could I Sylv
This is the address you gave not much help really
1911 census - address transcription
Address: 12 the Drapery

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33 RADFORD, Charles Henry Head Married M 33 1878 Manager Wine Spirit Merchant Wholesale And Retail London Highgate VIEW
33 RADFORD, Helene Wife Married
5 years F 31 1880 London Bermondsey VIEW
33 RADFORD, Charles William Son M 4 1907 London Highbury VIEW
33 WILLS, Henrietta Servant Single F 25 1886 General Servant Domestic Northamptonshire Everdon VIEW


Apart from the fact they had a servant

Note the occupation of the head and the house number looks like the same house but have changed the name of the road

1901 from FMP

Person: BRICE, Florence A
Address: 12, New Land, Northampton All Saints

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ROBERTS, John Head Married M 51 1850 Manager Wine & Spirit Vaults
Titchmarsh
Northamptonshire VIEW
ROBERTS, Harriet S Wife Married F 47 1854
Wellingborough
Northamptonshire VIEW
ROBERTS, Gertrude A Daughter Single F 18 1883 Milliners Apprentice
Wellingborough
Northamptonshire VIEW
ROBERTS, Reginald W Son Single M 13 1888
Rushden
Northamptonshire VIEW
BRICE, Florence A Servant Single F 19 1882 General Servant Domestic
Wellingborough
Northamptonshire VIEW

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William Ernest describes himself as a widower on that 1911 census


anyone been able to find a marriage for him??


I can't see one



sylvia

1911 census - household transcription
Person: DUFFIN, Florence
Address: Braunstone Frith Farm Glenfield Near Leicester

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DUFFIN, John Charles Head Married M 35 1876 Farmer Capt Oak Leicestershire VIEW
DUFFIN, Annie Wife Married
12 years F 39 1872 Bounday Leicestershire VIEW
DUFFIN, John Sidney Son M 9 1902 Batcheston Leicestershire VIEW
DUFFIN, Allan Son M 3 1908 Braunstone Frith Leicestershire VIEW
DUFFIN, Florence Adopted Daughter F 1 1910 Northampton Northampton VIEW
WORKER, Walter Servant Single M 21 1890 Farm Labourer Castle Gresley Derbyshire VIEW

These are the Duffins that Florence is with in 1911:

Marriages Dec 1898 (>99%)
DUFFIN John Charles Ashby de la Zouch 7a 241
LEESE Annie Ashby Z. 7a 241

I had hoped to see Annie as a Brice or Gissing!

My gut feeling is that W E Gissing is the SAME person as Private Gissing


HE registered the birth so knew his own name, but someone else gave the details on the death certificate, and they well not have known the initials for the person, just that he was a Private in the Army.


so ..... Private Walter Ernest Gissing is most likely the supposed father of the child.


Second question ..... how do you know that Florence Brice " lived/worked" with the Gissing family in 1909?

What is your evidence for that???


She might well have been taken in by them ....... or they migh have operated a small nursing home that she had gone to as an unmarried mother.


What was the connection with the Duffin fmaily? Why did they raise the child? Do they have a connection with either Florence or W E Gissing?


sylvia

1881
This is the same man with his mother and younger brother who are named on his army records

Name: William E. Gissing
Age: 8
Estimated birth year: abt 1873
Relation: Son
Mother's name: Maria B. Gissing
Gender: Male
Where born: Yarmouth, Norfolk, England

Civil Parish: Great Yarmouth
County/Island: Norfolk
Country: England

Street address: 45 Nelson Rd St
Education:

Employment status: View image
Occupation: Scholar

Registration district: Yarmouth
Sub-registration district: Yarmouth Southern
ED, institution, or vessel: 14
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Maria B. Gissing 38
William E. Gissing 8
Robert J. Gissing 2
William Gissing 53
Elenor Hall 80
Susan Gissing 61


As he seemed to be in prison a lot during his time in the army the 1911 census I gave you could well be him too

He is a private Gissing with the correct initials?? Ok not much else to go on really then leave it at that.

Edit so you have her birth cert registered by a W E Gissing her adopted parents said her father was private Gissing This man was in the right area although discharged in 1907 spent most of his army career in prison by the sound of it, why do you think it is not him?

jax

No there is no connection to the child. I also have the death certificate and that shows the father as Private Gissing.

Yes thanks, i think there could be a connection.

Does the informant of birth show a relationship to the child?

I have a birth certificate of a child born to an unmarried mother who died in childbirth. Although no father is shown in the correct column, the informant was her father and that is noted in the informant's section.


Gwyn

What do you think of those army details I gave you for W E Gissing....connected maybe??

jax

Yes her birth certificate names here mother as Florence Brice(deceased) and the person who registered the birth as W E Gissing.
Florence died in 1922 age 12. On her death certificate she is called Brice Gissing, there are no details of her mother but her father is named as Private Gissing.
In the census of 1911 she lived with the Duffin family and was their adopted daughter although I don't think they officially adopted her as her name of the gravestone is Duffin but the cemetary records have her as Florence Brice Gissing.

Yes I do have those details but the address i have is 12 The Drapery, Northampton

Yes that is her.

30 Riding, Northampton is the detail that is on the birth certificate of her daughter. It was in thre sub district of Saint Giles.

Julie

So Florence was registered with name Brice, so father didn't acknowledge paternity?

Births Dec 1909 (>99%)
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BRICE Florence Northampton 3b 57