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FBG -- not grandmother from Wiltshire -- mother, by our theory, no?

Births Jun 1889
Porton Lilian Emily Pewsey 5a 167

then Pratten -- then Hunt?

I'm going to PM Jenny my wild theory. ;)

Ha, ha, I know about the nosey! I am itching to know about my MIL and her early life, I think it would help explain a lot to my hubby about his life with her. Just a gut feeling, but I think there is much sadness in her early life.

Na... Janey and I are just nosey..:)

But dont tell her I said that about her...

And please to call me Fan or FBG as my full board name is a bit of a mouthful...

Bed for me..
Night

Hi FannyByGaslight,

I think this Roy may be a little young, I know she used to torment him by hitting him with her gas mask on the way to school, so I am thinking there may only be 4 or 5 years difference in their ages, as she left school at 13. I am waiting for the FTM 2011 platinum version to come out, it has 6 months Ancestry access with it, it should be out in Aus in November. You have a heart of gold to do this for others.

Thanks
Jen

I know the surnames are round the wrong way,but in the right place..

Name: Roy Harding
Mother's Maiden Surname: Fielding
Date of Registration: Jul Aug Sep 1943
Registration district: Bedwellty
Registration county: Wales
Volume Number: 11a
Page Number: 86

One to think about,and no marriage do I see for his likely parents in the Bedwellty area...

Just putting it here to think about when you have spoken to Uncle who hopefully will be able to give a little info...

Hi, and thanks for your replies, from a rather damp, chilly Australia, bit of a reversal there!

From the little Nessa has said about her birth family, she was one of 13, with 5 sets of twins, which doesn't fit with any of the possible parents, and she was fostered out (didnt say at what age) to a family called Fielding, with a son Roy, her foster brother, who was younger than her. She said her foster parents were quite elderly when they took her on. I am wondering if the large family story was a fabrication told to her to maybe explain her abandonment.

I have looked at the Births for Roy/Royston in FreeBMD, and none are in Wales, but I will keep looking here. Her brother-in-law, hubbies half uncle on his dad's side, is due to visit us on his way through in a couple of weeks, so I might sit and ask him if he knows anything about her life,any names etc he can offer. I'll keep looking and post anything I find.

Thank you once again for your marvelous help.
Cheers
Jen

You and me both JC.
I would like to know the names of her foster parents as there is only one family of Fieldings on 1911in Bedwellty,plus one extra male(Fred) fielding with a mother who appears to have remarried or married after his birth to a Mitcham..
Not checked it out.

And yes,those Pratten /Pratten births in Bedwellty could be her siblings before the marriage of the parents couldnt they?

One in Wilts hmm?Where her probable grandmother came from..!
Sent away to have it from the small miners towns prying eyes and wagging tongues?
Now that one is wild theory !

Births Jun 1889
Porton Lilian Emily Pewsey 5a 167

Pewsey reg dist covers Wootton Rivers, Wiltshire.

So that's her all right.

I'm glad to hear the birth cert FBG proposed was a winner! But I am so confused ...

What about those Pratten-Pratten births, 1924 and 1926, though -- would they fit at all with your wild theory FBG? Somebody else having wild theories, I dunno about that.

Oh, interestingly, there is a Pratten-Pratten birth in 1922 as well -- in Wiltshire.

Hello Jenny from down under from a warm and sunny Wales for once..

Nice to know I have not wasted your money and you have the correct cert.

My wild theory goes out the window now ,so is irrelevant.

Did her mother die after having her?I wonder as she was fostered out.
Saying she came from a large family does not seem true now,did she ever mention Hunt siblings?

We really need the details from the Frank Hunt/Prattten marriage now to get the ages of her parents(And to verify it is them).
My guess now is that Frank married a much younger woman and the large family were Franks from an earlier marriage as Janey found some possibility of in 1915 with the wife dying in 1925, just before the Pratten marriage in 1928.
I am unable to find any birth that I would want to call as that of Lilian May Pratten though.

The 1911 that Janey found earlier

PRATTEN, Benjamin Head Married M 29 1882 Coal Miner Labourer Hewer Monmouthshire Ebbw Vale
PRATTEN, Lillian Emily Wife Married
4 years F 21 1890 Wilts Wootton Rivers
PRATTEN, Stanley William Son M 2 1909 Monmouth Cwm
PRATTEN, Winnifred Maud Daughter F 0 (10 MONTHS) 1911 Monmouth Cwm

Registration District:
Bedwellty Sub District:
Aberystruth Enumeration District:
7 Parish:
Ebbw Vale

Address:
127 King Street Cwm Mon County:
Monmouthshire

****************************************

Name: Lillian E Pratten
Death Registration Month/Year: 1962
Age at death (estimated): 72
Registration district: Bedwellty
Inferred County: Monmouthshire
Volume: 8c
Page: 66

Hi again, I just received the birth certificate for Agnes Hunt, registered 9th Jan 1933, and the birth date is right at 27th November 1932. Fathers name is Frank Hunt, Mothers name is Lilian May Hunt formerly Pratt. The Hunt/Pratten marriage seems to fit, I wonder if the name on the birth certificate was misspelt?
Cheers
Jen

Wow, 1963 was the year my hubbie was born, his middle name is Frank, now we know where it came from.

Hi, and thank you all so much, it is really appreciated. I will send for the certificate, I'm sure the BDM offices in the UK will be thoroughly sick and tired of me by the time I have finished. I have already got a few through them, they are just so easy to deal with by internet!

I was looking in FreeBDM, so didnt find the one with the Pratt surname, thank you for that. I ordered a couple of possibles, but the dates were all wrong.

FannyByGaslight, I would be interested in hearing your theory, but I guess we have to make sure it is her first. I have copied all the info into a word document up to here.
Much thanks again
Jen

She does match, for sure, I was just trying to test the "large family" theory out. I wondered whether Lilian Pratt/en might have been married before, so mother's surname would be different for other births, but no luck with that.


Just for interest, and because having as many names as possible is good, this is likely sister Mary Ellen's marriage:

Marriages Jun 1913
Hart Thomas Hunt Bedwellty 11a 184
Hunt Mary E Hart Bedwellty 11a 184


?

Name: Frank Hunt
Death Registration Month/Year: 1963
Age at death (estimated): 74 = dob 1889
Registration district: Pontypool
Inferred County: Monmouthshire
Volume: 8c
Page: 179


1911

PRATTEN LILLIAN EMILY 1890 21 Bedwellty Monmouthshire

She answers to "wife". In the household are:

PRATTEN BENJAMIN 1882 29
PRATTEN STANLEY WILLIAM 1909 2
HOUSEHOLD PRATTEN WINNIFRED MAUD 1910 10 MONTHS

Marriages Jun 1907
PORTON Lilian Emily Pewsey 5a 333
PRATTEN Benjamin Pewsey 5a 333

Also:

Births Mar 1912
Pratten Ethel D Porton Bedwellty 11a 138

But he died in 1954.

Name: Benjamin Pratten
Death Registration Month/Year: 1954
Age at death (estimated): 72
Registration district: Bedwellty
Inferred County: Monmouthshire
Volume: 8c
Page: 103

Am I approaching FBG's theory?

But there are no Hunt-Porton births ... !!

However, there are Pratten-Pratten births in 1924 and 1926 ...

HUNT, Harold Son Single M 17 1894 Coal Miner Hewer Soudley Gloucestershire
HUNT, Frank Son Single M 21 1890 Coal Miner Hewer Soudley Gloucestershire
HUNT, William Head Widower M 68 1843 Railway Pensioner Bordley Glos Hire
HUNT, Mary Ellen Daughter Single F 28 1883 Soudley Gloucestershire

Registration District:
Bedwellty Sub District:
Tredegar Enumeration District:
18 Parish:
Ebbw Vale

Address:
103 Pennant St Ebbw Vale County:
Monmouthshire


My thoughts are .
Agnes Hunt is the one that I have given the birth for in my first post as the time,place and her saying Ebbw Vale are all there to make it seem the most likely,but unfortunately the only way to find out is to send for it to see what the date of birth is.

I will edit it out if /when you have taken all the details necessary to order it ,if you are going to.
I will edit it out in the morning.
Mind you it already is morning here in Wales and I was going long ago,but really must now.

The Agnes M Hunt I referred to earlier -- Q2 1932, Chepstow.

There are births with the same mother's surname 1924, 1926, 1928, 1929 (Violet A, Bedwellty), 1931, 1935 (all others Chepstow).

But I can't connect them to any marriage of Frank Hunt, and they do overlap the Pratten marriage.

How about ...

Marriages Sep 1915
Hunt Frank Winstone Bedwellty 11a 285
Winstone Hannah Hunt Bedwellty 11a 285

Births Mar 1897
Winstone Hannah Bedwelty 11a 106

Name: Hannah Hunt
Death Registration Month/Year: 1925
Age at death (estimated): 28
Registration district: Bedwellty
Inferred County: Monmouthshire
Volume: 11a
Page: 103


... There are Hunt-Winstone births in Bedwellty 1917, 1920 and 1921.

Then we come to the Pratten marriage!

Marriages Dec 1928
HUNT Frank Pratten Bedwellty 11a 245
Pratten Lilian Hunt Bedwellty 11a 245

1901

Name: Frank Hunt
Age in 1901: 12
Estimated birth year: abt 1889
Relation: Brother
Where born: Newnham, Gloucestershire, England

>>> Civil parish: Ebbw Vale
Town: Ebbw Vale
County/Island: Monmouthshire

Wm Hunt 29 -- coal miner
Margaret Hunt 28
Wm Jno Hunt 2
Charlty Hunt 26
Evan Wm Davies 25
Wm Hunt 58
Mary E Hunt 14
Frank Hunt 12
Harold S Hunt 9


1891

Civil parish: Newnham
Town: Flaxley
County/Island: Gloucestershire
Registration district: Westbury On Severn

William Hunt 49
Emma Hunt 40
Charles Harry Hunt 16
George Hunt 14
Albert Edris Hunt 12
Sidney John Hunt 9
Fredrick Jae Hunt 7
Ellen Mary Hunt 11
Frank Hunt 2


Births Mar 1889
Hunt Frank Westbury S. 6a 248

Thanks for the info, Jen, it does put our minds at ease. I know about burnt papers ... when my mystery gr-grfather died (I learned only last year), his daughter-in-law burned the case of papers he had carried with him from the 1870s in England, to India, back to England, to Australia, back to England, and finally to Canada, where he kept them with him for the whole 30 years he spent "visiting" his children after his wife's death. They were promised to the child of a different son (she died last year), but obviously the status-conscious daughter-in-law saw the potential for social scandal ...

It's nice to hear reunion stories like your husband's, and that someone finally told him the truth.

All by way of saying ... not much to report.

This Frank Hunt in 1911 seems a little old ... but that could make sense if Agnes was a late child.

HUNT FRANK 1890 21 Bedwellty Monmouthshire

http://www.1911census.co.uk/search/tnaform.aspx

I don't have paid access, but FBG (or someone else) will be able to give the details, such as his occupation. Ah -- he does answer to a search using miner as occupation.

Living with him are

HUNT WILLIAM 1843 68
HUNT MARY ELLEN 1883 28
HUNT HAROLD 1894 17

They all seem to be children of William. (Mary Ellen answers to "daughter" rather than "wife".)

Hi there, yes, she still is alive and living in care in Sydney Australia, she has vascular dementia, and cant answer any of our questions. She is my mother in law, my hubbie found out June last year that he has 3 sisters he was never told about, and now wants to find out more about his heritage, and has asked me to do some research. Nessa burnt all her certificates etc, so the boys wouldnt find out, she was dreadfully ashamed for some reason, I guess morals were different back in the 50's, but she was relieved when the boys found out. It is shame that she has gone downhill so fast, it would have been better coming from her. it was an older cousin that let the cat out of the bag, the boys were the only two in the whole family in Australia who didnt know.

Thank you all for your replies. We dont want to contact anyone, just do the family tree, he now has contact with his sisters, and we are planning a trip to England to meet them. His mum's daughter had no idea that her "mother" wasnt her birth mother until she found her birth certificate when her dad died, so there have been a lot of shocks all round. You have all given me some valuable leads

Thanks,
Kind regards
Jen

Edit: I'm positive here were some things happen that were very difficult for her to deal with at the time (to her, not by her), just from her reaction to things we have discussed in the past, and things she has said that make sense now the boys know about their sisters , but I cant really put it down on here.

There is an Agnes M Hunt registered apr-may-jun in Chepstow. (I do not know Wales geography.) There are five other births 1924-1935 with the same mother's surname.

Because any of those people might still be living I won't put the details here.