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Hello,

I have been unable to find Ellen Stevens as a child born circa 1865 in Semer Middlesex. I have found her on the 1891 and 1901 census returns as she married William Woolsgrove in 1887. I know from her marriage entry that her father's name was John and his occupation was a roadsman; and her address at the time she married was 23 Hill Street in the parish of St Mary, Newington.

Any help is greatly appreciated.

Kind regards

Rachel

Not heard of Semer?

1901 gives place of birth as Somers Town

Thank you Glitter Baby - I do find it hard to decipher some of the writing.

Regards

Rachel

for ref
1901 census

Address 46 Royal Ter
Civil Parish Newington
Rural District
Town or Village or Hamlet
Ecclesiastical Parish St Agnes
Parliamentary Borough or Division West Divn Of Newington
County Borough, Municipal Borough or Urban District Southwark
Administrative County London
Householder 1
Name Ellen Woolsgrove
Relation to Head of Family Daughter
Condition as to Marriage
Age Last Birthday 12
Sex Female
Profession or Occupation
Employment Status
Where Born London Newington
Language
Infirmity
Householder 2
Name Ellen Woolsgrove
Relation to Head of Family Wife
Condition as to Marriage Married
Age Last Birthday 33
Sex Female
Profession or Occupation
Employment Status
Where Born London Somers Town
Language
Infirmity
Householder 3
Name Florence Woolsgrove
Relation to Head of Family Daughter
Condition as to Marriage
Age Last Birthday 2
Sex Female
Profession or Occupation
Employment Status
Where Born London Newington
Language
Infirmity
Householder 4
Name Lilian Woolsgrove
Relation to Head of Family Daughter
Condition as to Marriage
Age Last Birthday 5
Sex Female
Profession or Occupation
Employment Status
Where Born London Newington
Language
Infirmity
Householder 5
Name William Woolsgrove
Relation to Head of Family Son
Condition as to Marriage
Age Last Birthday 10
Sex Male
Profession or Occupation
Employment Status
Where Born London Newington
Language
Infirmity
Householder 6
Name William Woolsgrove
Relation to Head of Family Head
Condition as to Marriage Married
Age Last Birthday 36
Sex Male
Profession or Occupation House Decorator
Employment Status
Where Born London Newington
Language
Infirmity

Here's Ellen on the 1891 census:

1891 England Census
about Ellen Woolsgrove
Name: Ellen Woolsgrove
Age: 23
Estimated birth year: abt 1868
Relation: Wife
Spouse's name: William
Gender: Female
Where born: Semer, London, England

Civil parish: Newington St Mary
Ecclesiastical parish: St Agnes
Town: London
County/Island: London
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View image

Registration district: St Saviour Southwark
Sub-registration district: St Peter Walworth
ED, institution, or vessel: 9
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
William Woolsgrove 26
Ellen Woolsgrove 23
Ellen Woolsgrove 2
William Woolsgrove 7/12

Forget fathers occupation for the moment.
Look at the census district.
1891
David Stevens John,
Jane abt 1874 Walworth, London, England Son Newington St Mary, London
1881
Ellen Stevens John,
Jane abt 1868 St Pancras, Middlesex, England Daughter Newington, London

1891
Look where son John was born
Jane Stevens abt 1835 Middlesex, England Wife Newington St Mary, London
John Stevens abt 1839 Middlesex, England Head Newington St Mary, London
John Stevens abt 1870 Somers Town, London, England Son Newington St Mary, London
David Stevens abt 1874 Walworth, London, England Son Newington St Mary, London

Excellent find thank you. So now to try to find an earlier census with son John on and the father with a similar occupation to that shown on the marriage certificate.

Just checked the occupation of the father John on the 1891 census for the above entry - his occupation is a carman - so could this be the right John Stevens?

the same family in 1881?

John STEVENS Head M Male 44 St Pancras, Middlesex, England Coal Porter
Jane STEVENS Wife M Female 47 St Pancras, Middlesex, England
Eliza STEVENS Daur Female 15 St Pancras, Middlesex, England
Ellen STEVENS Daur Female 13 St Pancras, Middlesex, England
John STEVENS Son Male 11 St Pancras, Middlesex, England
David STEVENS Son Male 7 Newington, Surrey, England

Source Information:
Dwelling 20 James Street
Census Place Newington, Surrey, England
Family History Library Film 1341125
Public Records Office Reference RG11
Piece / Folio 0550 / 19
Page Number 35

Any good??


1871 census transcription details for: Dumford Place, St Pancras, Kentish Town, Marylebone
National Archive Reference:
RG number: RG10 Piece: 241 Folio: 30 Page: 55

Reg. District: Pancras Sub District: Kentish Town
Parish: St Pancras Enum. District: 21
Ecclesiastical District: City/Municipal Borough: Marylebone
Address: Dumford Place, St Pancras, Kentish Town, Marylebone
County: London, Middlesex
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth
Year Occupation Where Born
STEVENS, John Head M 30 1841 Middlesex coal porter
STEVENS, Jane Wife F 30 1841 Middlesex
STEVENS, Eliza Daughter F 5 1866 Middlesex
STEVENS, Ellen Daughter F 3 1868 Middlesex
STEVENS, John Son M 1 1870 Middlesex

Hello,

Thank you for your replies. It looks like the right family - however, the only thing which does not quite fit is the father's occupation - in 1887 he is a roadsman, so am not sure how he would change occupation from being a coal porter.

I would be grateful for your opinions regarding his occupation please.

Kind regards

Rachel

one def of roadsman

Roadsman - mine official responsible for the making and maintenance of haulage roads.

this could fit with coal porter - just various occupations to do with coal

not sure there were any mines around Surrey tho!

PANCRAS REGISTRATION DISTRICT
Registration County : London.
Created : 1.7.1837.
Abolished : 1.1.1902 (succeeded by St. Pancras district).
Sub-districts : Camden Town; Gray's Inn Lane; Kentish Town; Regent's Park; Somers Town; <<<<<<<<<<<<<<
birth
Ellen Stevens 1868 Jan-Feb-Mar London, Middlesex

SatNav - thank you very much for that information - it is greatly appreciated.

I was wondering if anyone has access to the London Parish Registers and could please look up the baptism of Ellen Stevens 1868 in Pancras, London - her father is called John.

Kind regards

Rachel

Name: Ellen Stevens
Record Type: Baptism
Date: 14 May 1880
Father's Name: John Stevens (coal porter)
Mother's Name: Jane Stevens
Parish: Saint Mary, Newington
Borough: Southwark
County: Middlesex

Fantastic - that proves that we have the correct family. :)

Thank you all for your help it is greatly appreciated.

Kind regards

Rachel

Just for further proof.


1881 census transcription details for: 20, James Street, Newington
National Archive Reference:
RG number: RG11 Piece: 550 Folio: 19 Page: 35

Reg. District: St Saviour Southwark Sub District: St Peter Walworth
Parish: Newington Enum. District:
Ecclesiastical District: City/Municipal Borough:
Address: 20, James Street, Newington
County: Surrey
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth
Year Occupation ,
Disability Where Born
STEVENS, John Head Married M 44 1837 Coal Porter
St Pancras
Middlesex
STEVENS, Jane Wife Married F 47 1834
St Pancras
Middlesex
STEVENS, Eliza Daughter Single F 15 1866
St Pancras
Middlesex
STEVENS, Ellen Daughter Single F 13 1868
St Pancras
Middlesex
STEVENS, John Son Single M 11 1870
St Pancras
Middlesex
STEVENS, David Son Single M 7 1874
Newington
Surrey


Address for the baptism found by SatNav is also 20 James Street.


Liz

Liz,

Thank you for that additional information - it is appreciated.

Kind regards

Rachel