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I haven't been able to find Joseph's birth :( and I'm really hoping to get hold of his birth cert. His birth is about 1869 in the census his place of birth is recorded as Newington or Southwark.

Regulars to this page might be getting fed-up of this family by now, but this family have been more difficult than any of my other strands... so sorry, but I could do with more help.
Joseph started life as a Levi and ended up using the surname Barnett. He appears to have lived with the mother of his (5 surviving) children 'Sarah Bowler', for some considerable time before their 1908 marriage He was 39, she was 41). I'm very curious about this line and would be happy to get his birth certificate so I can varify his parentage.


Many Thanks for any help anyone feels able to give <:-) R

what was his fathers name?

the bloke that marries in 1908 is Joseph EDWARD Bennett

hers some for you ruby
not born newington
Household:

Name Relation Marital Status Gender Age Birthplace Occupation Disability
Barnett LEVI Head M Male 40 London City, Middlesex, England (Com) Traveller Fancy Goods
Emma C. LEVI Wife M Female 30 Maidstone, Kent, England
Joseph E. LEVI Son Male 12 Southwark, Surrey, England Scholar
Heneretta R. LEVI Daur Female 8 Liverpool Scholar
Amelia LEVI Daur Female 5 Newington, Surrey, England


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Source Information:
Dwelling 58 Elliotts Row
Census Place Southwark St George Martyr, Surrey, England
Family History Library Film 1341119
Public Records Office Reference RG11
Piece / Folio 0529 / 135
Page Number 44

Wow Minnie your quick off the mark ;) I believe his father's name was Barnett Levi. Another GR member says he was married to Emma Filmer, but has suggested that Joseph wasn't her child.

Hope that helps. :D

Joseph E Levi
Birth: abt 1869
Southwark, Surrey, England
Death:

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Military Memorial
View details Timeline1869
abt Birth Birth

Southwark, Surrey, England
1881
Age: 12 Residence

Southwark St George Martyr, London, England

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Parents
Barnett Levi
1841 – 1897 Caroline Emma Filmer
1850 – 1885
Show Siblings
Henrietta Rose Levi
1873 - Amelia Levi
1876 - Family Group Sheet
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1881 England Census
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Why are there no census records after 1930?
To protect the privacy of living persons who may appear in the censuses, The government requires a 72-year waiting period from the year a census is taken before it can be released. For this reason, the 1940 census will not be made available until the year 2012.

The 1790-1930 United States Federal Censuses have been made available. (Sad note: A fire in the U.S. Commerce Department in Washington, D.C., on 10 January 1921 destroyed most of the 1890 Census.) Learn more

so you really do need his marraige cert to confirm his fathers name & his status at the time.
-----------------------------------------
His fathers marriage to Emma

Marriages Mar 1872 (>99%)
Levi Barnett W.Derby 8b 770
Filmer Caroline Emma W. Derby 8b 770

which ties in locationwise with Henrietta's birth

Thanks Jean. That is the family. Joseph next appears as a Barnett in 1901. I search for Newington, Southwark, Lambeth area births but haven't come up with anything. :-/ R

Thanks Minnie - I actually have the marriage certificate for Joseph Edward Barnett and Sarah Bowler. 1908, Camberwell, He is a Cattle Dealer (as 1901 census) and he names his father as Barnett Barnett (I'm guessing to avoid confusion and that it is actually Barnett Levi - unless he changed his name too). He is recorded as deceased and previously having been a general dealer. Sarah Bowler's father is George William Bowler, Deceased, Goods Porter.
You're right, I really want the birth cert as confirmation, especially when it has been suggested that he is not the child of Emma.
Thanks R

1841 Dad or a relative?

Name: Barnett Levi
Age: 3 Mo
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1841
Gender: Male
Where born: Middlesex, England

Civil Parish: St Mary Whitechapel
Hundred: Ossulstone (Tower Division)
County/Island: Middlesex


Registration district: Whitechapel

Name Age
Lemon Levi 30
Elizabeth Levi 30
John Levi 7
Esther Levi 5
Alfred Levi 3
Isaac Levi 1
Barnett Levi 3 Mo
Margeret Sullivan 20
Elizabeth Turner 15

1851

Name: Barnet Levi
Age: 10
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1841
Relation: Son
Father's Name: Leman
Mother's Name: Elizabeth
Gender: Male
Where born: Whitechapel, Middlesex, England

Civil Parish: St Mary Whitechapel
Ecclesiastical parish: St Mark
County/Island: Middlesex
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability:

View Image

Registration district: Whitechapel
Sub registration district: Goodmans Fields
ED, institution, or vessel: 1e
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 57
Household Members:
Name Age
Leman Levi 41
Elizabeth Levi 37
John Levi 17
Esther Levi 15
Alfred K Levi 13
Isaac Levi 11
Barnet Levi 10
Alexander Levi 8
Henry Levi 6
Benjamin Levi 5
Eveline Levi 3
Margaret White 10

Ruby, you really do need to stop this.

Yet another thread, containing NONE of the information provided in your other threads, and no links to those other threads where it can be found.

Jean has just "found" the Barnett Levi household that I FOUND quite a while ago.

It is not fair to do this.

Not everyone reads every thread or memorises the minute details of someone else's family even if they have read it before.

You now have FOUR threads about the same thing.


http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.asp?wci=thread&tk=1113567
Joseph Edward Levi
I haven't been able to find Joseph's birth :( and
Ruby 30/12/2008 01:33:25 9

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.asp?wci=thread&tk=1112004
Joseph LEVI & Sarah BOWLER
Joseph Edward Barnett (abt 1868) transpired to hav
Ruby 22/12/2008 22:31:04 5

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.asp?wci=thread&tk=1109377
Levi's and Barnett's - SE London
It seems that my grandfather changed his name. The
Ruby 09/12/2008 16:38:18 9

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.asp?wci=thread&tk=1107887
BARNETT: Have info but can't find entry in registe
I have purchased Reginald Barnett's 1921 marriage
Ruby 02/12/2008 01:54:07 7


How many people do you want to do the same work for you?

The house rule is *one post per topic* -- right there in the rules that the website directs people to read before posting. This really is just simply not fair.

This one (from a previous thread) took a little work to come up with, so I'll add it here to spare anyone else:


1871:

Name: Joseph B Levy
Age: 7 months
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1870
Relation: Son
Father's Name: Bernet
Where born: Newcastle Upon Tyne

Name: Bernet Levy
Age: 27
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1844
Relation: Lodger
Where born: Goldinger Cureland
(that's how it seems to read; the original has a "?" beside it)

Occupation: Hawker
(Note -- Hawker and General Dealer, the occupation of Joseph's father on his marriage certificate, are the same thing)
Condition as to marriage: Widower

Civil Parish: All Saints
Ecclesiastical parish: St Ann
Town: Newcastle Upon Tyne
Registration district: Newcastle Upon Tyne
County/Island: Northumberland


which was why I was the one who said:

Possible, if Barnett was a travelling dealer?

Marriages Mar 1872
Cumming Rebecca W. Derby 8b 770
* Filmer Caroline Emma W. Derby 8b 770
GARNER William W. Derby 8b 770
* Levi Barnett W.Derby 8b 770


and sealed it with:


Henrietta Levi aged 8 in 1881, daughter of Barnett and Emma:

Births Jun 1872
LEVI Henrietta Rose W. Derby 8b 274

Amelia Levi aged 5 in 1881:

Births Sep 1875
Levi Amelia St. Saviour 1d 172

Thanks for letting us know - Ill leave this one then

PLEASE DON'T BE PUT OFF FROM HELPING
WITH THE BIRTH INFO I AM SEEKING
Thanks Evie ... I was excited to see addtions to my thread (thinking there might be a reference for Joseph's birth - which is what I have spent many hours searching for and am still hoping to find). I was horrified to see your comments. It would have been helpful to get some hints on linking threads etc , since I don't know about this. I didn't know I could refresh a thread - Had I, I would have done so. I don't want to waste others time, anymore than my own. I have been very honest about my previous threads and explained what I am looking for, i.e. 'birth registration'.

GR Community have been very helpful. I've added info as I have found out more (e.g. obtained certificates etc) and included the bits I thought would be required for a find and answered questions. I stated quite clearly my aim is to locate the birth certificate for Joseph and that remains the case (as Minnie recognised I really need it to varyify his parentage) and I was hoping someone else would have more success than I.

I know that the community sometimes test and explore the info already gained (e.g. challenge to marriage cert info above): I guess they don't want to go down the wrong path by being given inaccurate info.

I didn't realise I was commiting some GR crime continuing to try to get this info. I have not asked for census info and have indicated that I have this and some certificates. I stayed on late last night and tried to answer questions (something I know is important, and have thanked people, your self included over the months) and now people have been put off because the impression has been given that I'm a time waster. I thought I was doing the same as anyone else would who uses the community when stuck with a specific bit of information (i.e. registration of birth) - I obviously got it wrong.

I'll be reluctant to ask for help now and I guess some might see my name and be reluctant to give it.
:( R

Thanks Nerine
It has put me off a bit :(

Thank you people for info. If anyone is still interested in helping, can I just reiterate it is birth reg info for Joseph Edward Levi 1869 Southwark/Newington that I am looking for, His father is I believe Barnett Levi.

Might this be the birth - Emma's child?

Joseph Edward Filmer
1869 Apr-May-Jun
District: St George Southwark
County: Surrey
Volume: 1d
Page: 164

Andy

Births Dec 1868
LEVY Joseph Shoreditch 1c 186
LEVY Joseph Manchester 8d 323
Births Jun 1869
Levy Joseph Whitechapel 1c 372
Levy Joseph Whitechapel 1c 315
Births Mar 1870
LEVY Joseph Whitechapel 1c 407
LEVY Joseph London C. 1c 1
Births Jun 1870
Levy Joseph Liverpool 8b 138

Just catching up on this one - boy they are a complicated lot.

So the marriage of Barnett to Emma has been found in Liverpool ? 1872 which matches the second childs place of birth. So we have the possibility that Joseph was a child brought along to the marriage by Caroline Emma Filmer OR he was the son of a previous marriage of Barnetts OR he was born before the couple married. My money would go on a previous marriage for one of the couple

Marriages Mar 1872
Levi Barnett W.Derby 8b 770
Filmer Caroline Emma W. Derby 8b 770

Talking of Liverpool connections: ?

Deaths Dec 1870

Levi Barnett 75 Liverpool 8b 239

Wow there's a lot to take in there. Thanks for the Summary Heather. You've given quite a list of Joseph Levy's to choose from.

Thanks for another name in the tree 'Meyers' too 'Nerine.

I think Andy's Joseph Edward Filmer is worth a closer look, probably stupidly I'd not looked at this option.
THANK YOU :D* I think the time has come for some more certificates. xR