Find Ancestors

1) Robert c1835, 2) James c1836, 3) William c1839, 4) John c1840, 5) Duncan c1845, 6) David c1847, 7) MARY 1847, 8) Mary c1849, 9) CHARLES 1850, 10) Thomas c1853, 11) ADAM bp 04 JUN 1854, 12) ANDREW b 17 MAR 1856, 13) MARGARET 1858, 14) AGNES 1861.

It's not clear if Mary #7 died and Mary #8 was named after her, or they're really the same Mary (my guess is the latter). The only way you'll find out about kids who didn't make it to the census is either a) find a statutory birth rego for 1855, or b) find death or burial entries. Before 1855, this can be problematic, although Colinton does have burials for 1815-1854 - I've no idea how complete these records are, and note they didn't bother for the previous 160 y. One might also find kirkyard Memorial Inscriptions which can be pretty informative.

SP now sells images for OPR burials. I haven't gotten one yet - don't know if my folk are there yet either, although I do have some kirkyard burials. The alternative is to view films, either at the library (especially if you live in the Edinburgh area), or else via renting to view at an LDS FHC (world-wide). To check on the film, you can do a place search in the LDS FHL library catalog, but the quickest way here is to take one of the IGI OPR hits for the kids (say Mary), and click on her. At the bottom of her record is:

Source Information:
Batch No.: Dates: Source Call No.: Type: Printout Call No.: Type:
C116774 1820 - 1854 1066672 Film 6901530 Film
C116774 1843 1066672 Film NONE
Sheet:

Now click on the Source Call No (1066672 here), and drill down:

Title Old parochial registers for Colinton, 1654-1854
Authors Church of Scotland. Parish Church of Colinton (Midlothian) (Main Author)

Notes Microfilm of original records (book OPR 677 ; vols. 1-8.) in the New Register House, Edinburgh.


Click on the "view film notes" button at top right:

Note Location Film
v. 1. Births and Baptisms, 1654-1738. v. 2. Births and Baptisms, 1738-1819. v. 3. Marriages, 1654-1819. (Preferred film for viewing. Use this before ordering the other filming.) FHL BRITISH Film 1066671 Items 2 - 4
v. 3. Marriages and Proclaimations, 1756-1804, 1815-1819; Financial Disbursements, 1717-1724; Burials and Cloth Money, 1815-1829, 1847-1819. v. 4. Burials, 1815-1823; Marriage Proclaimations, 1815-1825; Births & Baptisms, 1815-1827. v. 5. Births & Baptisms (includes index), 1820-1854; Marriages & Proclaimations, 1820-1854. v. 6. Burials, 1819-1855. (Preferred film for viewing. Use this before ordering the other filming.) FHL BRITISH Film 1066672 Items 1 - 4
v. 7. Birth Index, 1738-1851. v. 8. Burial Index, 1826-1854. (Preferred film for viewing. Use this before ordering the other filming.) FHL BRITISH Film 1066672 Items 5 - 6
Index to Baptisms, 1731-1851 & 1654-1819 (another filming). FHL BRITISH Film 103002
Baptisms, 1815-1854; Marriages, 1654-1819, 1815-1854; Burials, 1716-1819, 1815-1854 (another filming). VAULT BRITISH Film 103003
Index to Burials, 1826-1854; Burials, 1815-1854 (another filming). VAULT BRITISH Film 103004

That is a big family!

I will try to find the marriage of Charles and Mary Josephine, although this has been very illusive and they may not have married. My American lady couldn't find it and thought that Mary may have been married to someone called Thomas Mannix (Joseph being their son). I think I will have to order the fiche for the local Mormon church and wade through it all. I have gone through all the census records in the UK for the family and Charles' (elder) age is stable. Mary's age changes for each census, giving her birth as somewhere between 1862 and 1868.

The births of the 2 yongest children in Scotland and the 1911 census all point back to their marriage in 1882 (if it took place) in the USA.

I can't think of any other way of figuring out if my Charles is child number 6 in the first census posting above, other than looking for any details of his parents if he did get married.

Julie

This is what I could find in 1871


1871 Scotland Census
Registration Number: 677
Registration district: Colinton
Civil Parish: Colinton
County: Midlothian
Address: Longstone
Occupation: Carter - Servant
ED: 6
Household schedule number: 156
Page: 29
Roll: CSSCT1871_154

James Fairley 36 Bathgate, Linlithgow Head Carter - Master Employ 3 Man
Jane Fairley 38 Colinton, Edinburgh Wife
Alexander Fairley 13 Colinton, Edinburgh Son
William Wolson 19 Edinburgh, Edinburgh Servant Carter - Servant
Alexr Sinclair 18 Colinton, Edinburgh Servant Carter - Servant
Charles Henderson 21 Edinburgh, Edinburgh Servant Carter - Servant



1871 Scotland Census
Registration Number: 677
Registration district: Colinton
Civil Parish: Colinton
County: Midlothian
Address: Juniper Green
Occupation: Scholar
ED: 4
Household schedule number: 163
Page: 37-38
Roll: CSSCT1871_154

Mary Henderson 53 Kirknewton, Midlothian Head
Thomas Henderson 19 Colinton, Midlothian Son Paper Maker Enginer
Adam Henderson 17 Colinton, Midlothian Son Paper Maker Enginer
Andrew Henderson 15 Colinton, Midlothian Son Paper Maker Enginer
Margaret Henderson 13 Colinton, Midlothian Daughter Paper Maker Enginer
Agnes Henderson 10 Colinton, Midlothian Daughter Scholar
David Henderson 25 Colinton, Midlothian So;l Mason
Elizabeth Henderson 22 Lochwinnoch, Renfrewshire Son's Wife
Margaret F Henderson 3 Colinton, Midlothian Grandaughter
Elizabeth A Henderson 1 Pocenock, Renfrewshire Grandaughter

[Looks like some overenthusiastic dittoing with occup]


1871 Scotland Census
Registration Number: 685/5
Registration district: Newington
Civil Parish: Edinburgh St Cuthberts
County: Midlothian
Address: 10 Dick Place
ED: 86
Household schedule number: 57
Page: 18
Roll: CSSCT1871_166

Robert Inglis 51 Nk Head Publisher "gall & Inglis" Employing 56 Hands
Alice Mary Inglis 9 Edinburgh Daughter Scholar
James Gall Inglis 6 Edinburgh Son Scholar
Mary Henderson 23 M Loth, Colinton Servant Domestic Servt

These seem to be the two sons not with the family in 1851:

Piece: SCT1851/677 Place: Colinton -Midlothian Enumeration District: 3
Civil Parish: Colinton Ecclesiastical Parish, Village or Island: -
Folio: 692 Page: 15 Schedule: 60
Address: Wood Hall Mains

Surname First name(s) Rel Status Sex Age Occupation Where Born Remarks
CLAPHAN John Head M M 35 Farmer Of 84 Ac Emp 3 Men Midlothian - Colinton
CLAPHAN Mary Wife M F 35 Farmer's Wife Midlothian - Colinton
CLAPHAN Margaret Dau - F 13 Farmer's Daughter Midlothian - Colinton
CLAPHAN Mary Dau - F 10 Scholar Midlothian - Colinton
CLAPHAN Thomas D. Son - M 6 Scholar Midlothian - Colinton
CLAPHAN Elizabeth B Dau - F 3 Midlothian - Colinton
CLAPHAN John Son - M 8m Midlothian - Colinton
CRAWFORD Elizabeth Servnt U F 25 House Servant Lanarkshire - Hamilton
HENDERSON James Servnt U M 13 Farm Ag Lab Midlothian - Kirknewton
THOMSON Agnes Visitr U F 20 Dress Maker Midlothian - Ratho



1851 Scotland Census
Parish Number: 663
Civil Parish: Boness
Town: Boness
County: West Lothian
Address: 3 Ship Masten Land
ED: 8
Page: 8
Household schedule number: 24
Roll: CSSCT1851_173

James Craig 30 Kirkmichael, Ayreshire Head Ironstone Miner
Rebeca Craig 26 Lanark Wife Ironstone Miners Wife
Robert Henderson 14 Kirkoneston, Midlothian Lodger Ironstone Miner


There are MLN & WLN maps showing parishes at:
http://www.electricscotland.com/history/gazetteer/

Here are some of the earlier censuses from FreeCEN (plus one based on Ancestry), and some IGI stuff:


Results for: John Henderson, Marriage, Midlothian, Scotland, British Isles
Spouse: Mary Weir
Exact Spelling: Off
Batch Number: m116906

International Genealogical Index / British Isles - 1
Select records to download - (50 maximum)
1. JOHN HENDERSON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Marriage: 06 OCT 1834 Kirknewton And East Calder, Midlothian, Scotland



Results for: Birth/Christening, 1831 - 1871, Midlothian, Scotland, British Isles
Father: John Henderson, Mother: Mary Weir
Exact Spelling: Off

International Genealogical Index / British Isles - 14
Select records to download - (50 maximum)
1. MARY HENDERSON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 22 AUG 1847 Colinton, Midlothian, Scotland

2. MARGARET HENDERSON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Birth: 14 JUN 1858 Colinton, Midlothian, Scotland

3. ANDREW HENDERSON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Birth: 17 MAR 1856 Colinton, Midlothian, Scotland

4. AGNES HENDERSON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Birth: 29 MAR 1861 Colinton, Midlothian, Scotland

5. ADAM HENDERSON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 04 JUN 1854 Colinton, Midlothian, Scotland

6. CHARLES HENDERSON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 03 FEB 1850 Colinton, Midlothian, Scotland

7. Duncan W Henderson - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Birth: About 1845 Colinton, Midlothian, Scotland

8. James Henderson - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Birth: About 1836 , Midlothian, Scotland

9. John Henderson - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Birth: About 1840 Colinton, Midlothian, Scotland

10. Robert Henderson - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Birth: About 1835 , Midlothian, Scotland

11. Charles Henderson - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Birth: About 1850 Colinton, Midlothian, Scotland

12. David Henderson - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Birth: About 1847 Colinton, Midlothian, Scotland

13. Mary Henderson - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Birth: About 1849 Colinton, Midlothian, Scotland

14. Thomas Henderson - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Birth: About 1853 Colinton, Midlothian, Scotland

[The first 6 records above are OPR or GRO(S) index extracts - the last 8 are LDS member submissions]




Piece: SCT1841/677 Place: Colinton -Midlothian Enumeration District: 4
Civil Parish: Colinton Ecclesiastical Parish, Village or Island: Colinton
Folio: 4 Page: 13
Address: Juniper Green

Surname First name(s) Sex Age Occupation Where Born Remarks
HENDERSON John M 31 Mason Journeyman Midlothian
HENDERSON Mary F 22 Midlothian
HENDERSON Robert M 6 Midlothian
HENDERSON James M 5 Midlothian
HENDERSON William M 2 Midlothian
HENDERSON John M 6m Midlothian


Piece: SCT1851/677 Place: Colinton -Midlothian Enumeration District: 4
Civil Parish: Colinton Ecclesiastical Parish, Village or Island: -
Folio: 692 Page: 29 Schedule: 108
Address: -

Surname First name(s) Rel Status Sex Age Occupation Where Born Remarks
HENDERSON John Head M M 46 Stone Mason Midlothian - Ratho
HENDERSON Mary Wife M F 31 House Keeper Midlothian - Currie
HENDERSON William Son - M 10 Scholar Midlothian - Ratho
HENDERSON John Son - M 8 Scholar Midlothian - Colinton
HENDERSON Duncan Son - M 6 Scholar Midlothian - Colinton
HENDERSON David Son - M 4 Midlothian - Colinton
HENDERSON Charles Son - M 1 Midlothian - Colinton
[Ancestry gives the 1851 town and address as: Juniper Green ]

Looks good. Keep us posted!

Possibly a breakthrough!

I looked at the 1911 census again and found a Charles J Henderson aged 20 (about right) in the military, but no image available and the wrong middle initial. However, that set off a chain of events...

I looked at military records in national archives and found a Charles Henderson who enlisted into the Royal Marines Artillery on 16/09/1909, I looked at the record and he was born on 7 April 1890 (looking good) in Boston - although it states Lincolnshire - at a stretch it could be Boston USA. Bear with me for tenuous links time:

the 1911 census image has Boston scribbled out next to his mothers place of birth, just leaving USA showing. His parents were supposed to be married in Cohassett, Mass, USA in 1882. My American lady who has tried to find them said that at that period people went across the bay to Boston to get married as they were not as strict as in Cohassett.

The father of Charles (in the artillery) is Charles Henderson in Wallsend. The rest of the Henderson family were living in Wallsend in the 1911 census - so this could be the son Charles (hurrah), which means if he was born in Boston then they had to come over after 7 April 1890, but before the 1891 census when they were living in Edinburgh. Now a very narrow window.

The search continues.

Julie :o)

Mmm. I've just gone back to my 1901 records and then looked again for Charles in 1911. There are a lot, but if you type place of birth as a search criteria as either USA, Scotland or Edinburgh then there are zero returns (the plot thickens). If you leave blank then there are load of possibilites. I will have a wade through and see if I can find him. He may not be in England for this census... Either way, not yet any closer to knowing how narrow the gap can be for when the family came to England from the US yet...

Julie

Ah, right. ;)

"Mary Josef? Henderson ne Bandura."

But Charles Jr was born in the US?

Aha - not per the 1911 census! Mother Mary Josephine and children Joseph and Robert show as born in the US (when I use that in search criteria), but not son Charles. (Mind you, I don't see son Charles in the 1911, so I may have that wrong anyhow.)

Possibly in Scotland, and possibly the mother's name would make more sense?

Hi again. Thanks for the advice.

Also, some answers.

I have Emmanuel'sbirth record (details in initial post when I was at the brick wall stage). I have them in the 1911 census, but I didn't get as far as the 1891 with Scotland's People.

Looking back at the posting for the 1891 details, it would suggest that that this is the same family. In this case you are right and it narrows down the time when they could have come across, possibly as narrow as 1890 to 1891, but I've become vary wary of census records showing the children's birth in USA, as it was completely wrong in the 1901 census. The worst case scenario is that they came across somewhere between 1884 and 1891.

Julie :o)

Btw - Emmanuel Henderson was born 1892 in Scotland? Scotlandspeople gives one result for that search.

Have you viewed the record to see what info is given about his mother?


And for info, the 1911 census:

HENDERSON CHARLES 1851 60 Tynemouth Northumberland
HENDERSON MARY JOSEPHINE 1865 46 Tynemouth Northumberland
HENDERSON JOSEPH 1884 27 Tynemouth Northumberland
HENDERSON EMANNUEL 1893 18 Tynemouth Northumberland
HENDERSON ROBERT 1895 16 Tynemouth Northumberland

(Picked them out of the list of Hendersons living with a Charles, but not sure what the complete household composition is.)

Updates always appreciated!

If you want to try tracking down the 1880 Hendersons in the US -- I searched 1900 for Jenn* Henderson in Massachusetts born 1880, and I can't see the details because I don't pay, but top of the list is:

Jennie Henderson
city, Suffolk, Massachusetts
birh date location
White relation

There are other Jennie/Jenny Hendersons in Suffolk County as well, but the one at the top of the results list would be the best match for my criteria. None show as having mother Margaret. (That Jennie is not living with parents, it seems.) There are of course Margarets in the vicinity.

And a tip about census searches - do consider getting a basic sub to Ancestry. The credit system here is not cost-effective in the long run.

To search for incoming passengers at Ancestry, i.e. to see details, one needs the sub above my own, so unfortunately I can't help there.

You can mess around with that search even without subscribing too, though:

http://content.ancestry.co.uk/iexec/?htx=List&dbid=1518

Of course, there are half a dozen possibles ...

The time frame may be slightly narrower, if that's them in the 1891 census above.

I thought those who helped me might like an update and I have another plea for help...

You were right in the census information above and I have managed to go back and find Charles parents and grandparents (Possibly) - all born around Edinburghshire in the 1800's. A lovely lady in America may have uncovered a scandal with a possibility of Mary being married before to someone called Thomas Mannix (Joseph being their son), which could mean that Charles and Mary were never married. This would also be the case if my Charles Henderson is the same Charles Henderson and wife Margaret in the 1880 census.

Anyway, back to the plot. I've found Charles and Mary on the 1911 census and they only ever had the 4 children listed in the previous messages. The record states that the eldest child Joseph was born in USA (possibly Boston, but this is scribbled out and difficult to read).

The short story is that I am no nearer finding a marriage for Charles and Mary (Mary Josephine in the 1911 census). I have found a possible trip across for Charles to the USA on the Circassia in 1879 (aged 28), but if this is him, all that it tells me is that he left from Glasgow and landed in New York and he was a painter (his occupation is 'house painter' in the English census records when he comes back to Blighty in the late 1800s early 1900s).

Charles was born on 29 December 1849 and baptised on 3 Feb 1850 in Colinton. He appears in the Scottish census for 1851 (aged 1) and 1861 (aged 10) , but I've run out of credits trying to find him in the 1871.

Now for my plea for help... Does anyone have access to ship passenger lists that might find him and Mary (Maria) Josephine (Joseph) coming from the USA to the UK? If Joesph was born in the USA (1911 census shows this) then it would have to be between 1884 (when Joseph was born) and 1892 (when Emmanuel is born).

Thanks for reading. If I have rambled beyond clear understanding please point me back to the path of logic.

Julie :o)

Wow - thank-you everyone, I will be busy now chasing down your finds. How fantastic, I thought that I had hit a wall with these people. I'm so excited!

Julie

Btw, this is probably the place of marriage stated:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cohasset,_Massachusetts

in Norfolk County, Mass.

In the IGI for Maria Bandera born in Mexico (a possibility), there are several born in the early 1860s. One in Hidalgo, coincidentally.

Josef sounds Hungarian (Josefa? as in Archduchess Maria Josefa).

But Maria Josefa is equally Spanish/Mexican.

I don't subscribe for access to images at ancestry.com, but this is the one Bandura-sounding name in Texas in 1880:

Name: Moralis Bendurus
Home in 1880: Precinct 1, Bee, Texas
Age: 36
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1844
Birthplace: Mexico
Relation to Head of Household: Something other than a direct relationship (Other)
Neighbors: View others on page
Occupation: Shepard
Marital Status: Single
Gender: Male


There's a Banderas Bay in Puerto Vallarta!

And there are a few people named Bandera/Banderas in the 1880 US census, in Louisiana and Texas. The Louisianans come from an Austrian Bandera, and the Texans are of Mexican origin. There are also people named Bandera in Texas in the 1920 and 1930 census, including in Hidalgo county where some are in 1880.

I wouldn't put too much stock in the spelling on the birth cert necessarily. Of course, you might want to check the image for the 1891 Scottish census at scotlandspeople to check whether it actually says Texas. ;)

The 1880 US census does have:


Name: Charles Henderson
Home in 1880: Boston, Suffolk, Massachusetts
Age: 29
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1851
>> Birthplace: Scotland
Relation to Head of Household: Self (Head)
Spouse's Name: Margaret
Father's birthplace: Scotland
Mother's birthplace: Scotland
>> Occupation: Painter
Marital Status: Married
Race: White
Gender: Male

Name: Margaret Henderson
Home in 1880: Boston, Suffolk, Massachusetts
Age: 26
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1854
Birthplace: Scotland
Relation to Head of Household: Wife
Spouse's Name: Charles
Father's birthplace: Scotland
Mother's birthplace: Scotland

Name: Jennie Henderson
Home in 1880: Boston, Suffolk, Massachusetts
Age: 7M
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1879
Birthplace: Massachusetts
Relation to Head of Household: Daughter


Given the variations in the other census, with the occupation the one constant, he looks like a possible, possibly with a first wife.

the Bandura's I came across all came from Hungary

Husband
Stanislav Bandura Pedigree

Birth:
Wife
Julie Cleboska Pedigree
:
1. Mary Bandura Pedigree
Female

Birth: 18 DEC 1885 Chicago, Cook, Illinois