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Hi, I'm trying to find a marriage record of a relation who married aboard Queen Mary 2 in America, Dec 1984/Jan 1985. Their names are Greta Herman and Peter Brooks. I can not seem to find anything on their marriage at all. How do I find this marriage record?

Any help would be much appreiciated.

i will try findmypast but what if i can not find it on there, what do i do next?

Nothing shown up on findmypast site for marriages overseas with surname herman as i looked at both years 1984/1985. Starting to get abit annoying.

Perhaps, British Embassy in USA can help.
The Queen Mary was owned by Cunard SS co Ltd............think offices now closed in UK so its back to Cunards offices in USA to see what help they can provide.

I was wondering whether anyone could look at dec 1984/jan 1985 on England Marriage Record on Ancestry, just to double check before I try contacting the Cunards.

Greta D Herman (born in 1949)
Peter Brooks

I know they had one child born in Dec 1985.

Any help would be greatful.

No Greta Herman marriage coming up on Ancestry 1984-1986

so that would also mean nothing comes up for peter brooks as well?

None coming up with a Peter Brooks marrying a Herman.Was it not the case that although the Captain could conduct a marriage it had to be registered at first port of call

In the past, journeys at sea could last months or years. Maybe that is why people came to believe that a ship's captain has the power to perform marriages. But this is, apart from a few very recent examples, a myth.
Every society has some kind of marriage ceremony — authorised and/or recognised by state, religion or society.
Sometimes the religious authority acts as an agent of the state so that the religious marriage is automatically legally recognised.
But sometimes there has to be a separate state ceremony after the religious ceremony, and sometimes the act of living together as man and wife automatically "marries" the partners under common law.
In some instances, the ceremony can be held anywhere, but sometimes it can be held only in specific locations, for example, churches and registry offices.
But ships' captains have never (until very recently) performed marriages.
In fact, both the US and UK governments have specific regulations relating to marriage for the captains of military and civilian ships.
They are clearly forbidden to perform marriage ceremonies, and do not, and never have had, the authority to do so.
Let me give you a direct quote from the US Navy Code of Federal Regulations, Title 32, Subtitle A, Chapter VI, Subchapter A, Part 700, Subpart G, Rule 716, also known as 32 CFR 700.716):

The commanding officer shall not perform a marriage ceremony on board his ship or aircraft. He shall not permit a marriage ceremony to be performed on board when the ship or aircraft is outside the territory of the United States, except: (a) In accordance with local laws … and (b) In the presence of a diplomatic or consular official of the United States.

No marriage on the GRO

Having a child doesn't necessarily mean they were married.

BTW - Queen Mary 2 was launched in 2004 -

The original liner Queen Mary was de-registered in 1967, and berthed at Long Beach California.

Cunard's offices are in Southampton, but they did not own the Queen Mary in the 1980's

Assuming the date's right, then it would be the original Queen Mary which is moored in Long Beach. One can buy the m.cert from the state - although they say they have a 6 m backlog:
http://www.cdph.ca.gov/certlic/birthdeathmar/Pages/default.aspx
or from Los Angeles county:
http://rrcc.lacounty.gov/RECORDER/BDM_Records.cfm

I have sent an email to the one in Longbeach and got a reply back saying they do not hold kind of records regarding marriages.

I thought if anyone got married aboard, they would have to registered here first otherwise wont be legal.

I'm starting to think whether its a tax dodge or something more sneaky.

As the Queens Mary is an established hotel now, it's quite possible they got maried in the 'hotel' it just happens to be a boat!

I think the whole marriage at sea thing is a little over the top.... some places could do it, it Ellen had quoted the rest of the page she pasted from there have been long standing court arguments about captains marrying on a boat, and couples now trying to divorce. Some succeeded in getting the marriage recognised before divorcing while some had the recognition thrown out.

The link Ellen possibly used is here...

http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/546/are-ships-captains-allowed-to-marry-people-at-sea

Read it and make your own mind up, but i do think it's not a relevant piece of info as in 1984 the boat was not a sailing vessel.

I would suggest they married in the hotel there, and the rest just sounds glorious on paper!!!

Vicky
"I thought if anyone got married aboard, they would have to registered here first otherwise wont be legal."

There are strict laws wherever you choose to marry, you can (almost) marry anywhere you like as long as you abide by the local traditions. My Aunt married on a beach somewhere hot, but had to have the honeymoon first as they had to be resident there for 10 days before they could wed. The marriage is not registered here in the UK. It does make divorcing a little weird tho.

As my friend found out when she made a mistake in Florida on a long holiday.... she managed to divorce over the internet!!! Gotta love America!


Tracey x

Thats quite interesting.

It would be nice if they have registered their marriage here, would make it easier for me with sorting out the family history.

I think I'll give this marriage record a rest as at this moment I can't be bothered to look any further into it. But thanks for the help regarding this intriguing matter.

You seem to be missing the point, Vicky - if these people married on the Queen Mary in the late 1980's they were marrying in a moored de-registered 'vessel' which had been converted into a hotel etc.

They were not married in a sea-going ship