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Hi
I really hope someone can help with this, as it is rapidly driving me mad! Sorry it's a bit long.
In my family my gran was always called Elizabeth Bryant and her birthday was on 11th Feb 1880. This is the d.o.b shown on her death certificate, which is in her married name (Elizabeth Rowland, 2nd Qurtr 1971). I found her on the 1891 census in West Ham, and her mother is shown as a widow - Bridget Bryant. I cannot find them on the 1881 census. I applied for her birth certificate, and the GRO came back and told me they have no record of it.
I applied for her marriage certificate and her father is given as James Bryant. The only wedding between a James Bryant and a Bridget is in Bristol in 1872 (to Bridget Ryan). But the census records say nothing about Bridget being from Bristol. To add to that, the marriage certificate has my Grandfather's father as James Rowland, and I know for sure his name was Isaac Rowland! On the certificate she is listed as 19 in 1897, which would make her born in 1878.
It has occured to me that Bristol, Portsmouth and London are all ports - is it likely that a wife would have followed a navy husband from port to port? But that still doesn't explain why my gran has no birth certificate!
I am so confused! I would really like to be clear who my great grandparents were.
My Gandmother had a sister called Mary Ann and a brother called Charles, and I think another sister called Ellen. She is buried with Mary Ann.
I think the 1911 census says Bridget had another child that died - I can't find my copy of it now. But I have no details of that child.
My grandmother used to talk about having Irish roots, but I don't know if it is true.
I really would be grateful for any help, or just a shove in the right direction.
Thank you.

For background:
1891 England Census
Bridget Bryant
Age: 50 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1841 Relation: Head Where born: Stratford, Essex, England Civil parish: West Ham Ecclesiastical parish: St Paul Town: Stratford County/Island: Essex
Country: England Condition as to marriage: widow Registration district: West Ham Sub-registration district: Stratford ED, institution, or vessel: 24

Bridget Bryant 50 Stratford Essex
Mary A Bryant 17
Charles Bryant 13
Elizabeth Bryant 11

Source Citation: Class: RG12; Piece: 1315; Folio 140; Page 34; GSU roll: 6096425.

1881 England Census
James Hennessey
Age: 42 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1839 Relation: Head Spouse's Name: Bridget Hennessey Gender: Male Where born: Westham, Essex, England Civil parish: West Ham County/Island: Essex Country: England Street Address: 17 Elizabeth Gard Condition as to marriage: Married Occupation: Dock Laborer Registration district: West Ham Sub-registration district: Stratford
ED, institution, or vessel: 26

James Hennessey 42 West Ham
Bridget Hennessey 40 West Ham
James Hennessey 12 West Ham
Ellen Hennessey 10 Gosport
Mary A. Hennessey 8 West Ham
Charles Hennessey 3 West Ham
Elizabeth Hennessey 1 West Ham

Source Citation: Class: RG11; Piece: 1708; Folio: 125; Page: 40; GSU roll: 1341408.

Can you say where you got the marriage cert, please.

This is the only marriage on freebmd in 1897


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Marriages Dec 1897 (>99%)
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Bryant Elizabeth W. Ham 4a 209
GREEN John William W Ham 4a 209
Kemp Mary Ann W. Ham 4a 209
ROWLAND Ernest George W. Ham 4a 209

That must be them! Thank you so much. I have been looking for months.
:)
You are amazing! How did you find them?

I wonder where Bryant comes from?

If Bridget was a widow, the number of children she'd had would not be on 1911 census.

Bridget in 1901

Name: Bridget Bryant
Age: 60
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1841
Relation: Mother-in-Law
Gender: Female
Where born: West Ham, Essex, England

Civil parish: West Ham
Ecclesiastical parish: St Paul
County/Island: Essex
Country: England


Registration district: West Ham
Sub-registration district: Forest Gate
ED, institution, or vessel: 40
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 163
Household Members: Name Age
William Newton 33
Ellen Newton 29
William Newton 10
Ellen Newton 9
Florence Newton 7
Lily Newton 5
Winifred Newton 2
Charles A Newton 7 Months
Bridget Bryant 60
Mary A Bryant 27

Flick, that marriage on freebmd is my grandparents - Ernest Rowland and Elizabeth Bryant. I got the certificate from the GRO, and it lists Ernests father as James Rowland, but all the census records clearly give his father as Isaac.

1871
James Hennessey
Age: 32
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1839 Relation: Private Gender: Male
Where born: Westham, Essex, England Civil parish: Vessels
Town: Portsmouth Harbour County/Island: Hampshire
Country: England Registration district: Portsea Island
Sub-registration district: Portsea Town ED, institution, or vessel: Duke of Wellington, including her Tenders, the Victory, Black Eagle, Firequeen, and Sprightly Household schedule number: 1

Source Citation: Class: RG10; Piece: 1134; Folio: 225; Page: 13; GSU roll: 827781.

There isn't any sign on freebmd of a marriage for James Hennessey to a Bridget

I agree that Bridgets details shouldn't be on the 1911 census, but I think I am right in saying that the 1911 census is shown as it was filled in, and someone filled it in wrong. So it shows how many years she was married, and how many children she had. She also puts her name on it as Mrs Bryant, rather than Bridget Bryant!

what about this ? children match ?


1881 England Census about Charles Hennessey
Name: Charles Hennessey
Age: 3
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1878
Relation: Son
Father's name: James Hennessey
Mother's name: Bridget Hennessey
Gender: Male
Where born: West Ham, Essex, England
Civil parish: West Ham
County/Island: Essex
Country: England
Street Address: 17 Elizabeth Gard
Education:

Employment status:

View image
Registration district: West Ham
Sub-registration district: Stratford
ED, institution, or vessel: 26
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
James Hennessey 42
Bridget Hennessey 40
James Hennessey 12
Ellen Hennessey 10
Mary A. Hennessey 8
Charles Hennessey 3
Elizabeth Hennessey 1

View
Original
Record

View original image
sorry patchem, you're streets ahead of me

Sorry...........misunderstood your posting re the cert....there was so much of it.....lol!

Births Sep 1871 (>99%)
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HENNESSY Ellen Alverstoke 2b 508

1871

Name: Bridget Hennesey
Age: 31
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1840
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: James Hennesey
Gender: Female
Where born: Stratford, Essex, England
Civil parish: Alverstoke
Ecclesiastical parish: Forton St John the Evangelist
County/Island: Hampshire
Country: England
Registration district: Alverstoke
Sub-registration district: Alverstoke
ED, institution, or vessel: 5g
Household schedule number: 367
Household Members: Name Age
James Hennesey 32
Bridget Hennesey 31
James Hennesey 1

I'm sure that is them - apart from the names, the next place on that census sheet is Francis Street and that is where they are living as the Bryant family 10 years later.

I wonder if they were just never married, and then when he died she went back to her maiden name?

Found this on familysearch.org????

James Hennessy

England Marriages, 1538–1973

spouse: Bridget Connor
marriage: 02 Jun 1872 — Alverstoke,Hampshire,England

record title: England Marriages, 1538–1973
groom's name: James Hennessy
bride's name: Bridget Connor
marriage date: 02 Jun 1872
marriage place: Alverstoke,Hampshire,England
indexing project (batch) number: M07358-2
system origin: England-ODM
source film number: 918908

According to 1881 census, Ellen was born in Hampshire??

Yes it says she was born in Portsmouth, which could make sense if James was on a ship down there....

And Connor is a good Irish name!

I can't believe all this. I am speechless, and so grateful.