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rootgatherer i go to the mitchell library quite a lot but have never tried looking at the poor relief - will definitely give it a try your help has been fantastic

regards jim

Jim if you live nearby, it is worth taking a look at the Poor Relief records in the Mitchell Library. They are all indexed and you never know what you'll find! If Thomas's Mum claimed you might well get an insight on how difficult life was for deserted / widow women in those days. Some of the comments written regarding these poor souls are amazing. My own great aunt was branded immoral by these "do gooders". The poor widow was doing all she could to feed 3 children under 5 years old, having just buried her husband and already lost 2 children. Well she didn't take much money from the Relief Board- she died a couple of weeks later (she wasn't even 30 years of age) and left her 3 children as orphans.

Aileen thanks for info on agnes simpson death - i have now found her death cert on scotlands people and now have her parents names confirmed. like yourself cant find birth cert will keep trying

regards jim

thanks rootgatherer (again) will check on your tips and also the info from aileen has given me.
about thomas ralston yes i got an RCE which gave me his birth and the court ruling who was his father. although thomas's mother was free and easy she had a few kids by other people after her husband supposedly died in USA 1888 and she named him as the father ! now i beleive in the holy ghost !

regards jim

Siblings for Agnes

28/03/1805 SIMPSON JEAN JOHN SIMPSON/AGNES ORR FR491 SLAMANNAN /STIRLING

06/11/1806 SIMPSON MARY JOHN SIMPSON/AGNES ORR FR494 SLAMANNAN /STIRLING

I can't find a birth but this is not unusual

Death for Agnes

1888 MCRUER AGNES SIMPSON F 76 GORBALS GLASGOW CITY/LANARK

Agnes McRuer widow of John McRuer died 03/11/1888 parents given as John (Joiner, master) and Agnes Simpson ms Orr ......cert signed by Archibald McRuer (son)

1881 census

Name: Agnes McRuer
Age: 65
Estimated birth year: abt 1816
Relationship: Head
Gender: Female
Where born: Slamanan, Stirlingshire
Registration Number: 644/12
Registration district: Gorbals
Civil parish: Glasgow Gorbals
County: Lanarkshire
Address: 192 Main Street
ED: 47
Household schedule number: 47
Line: 6
Roll: cssct1881_247
Household Members:
Name Age
Agnes McRuer 65
Agnes McRuer 35
Janet McRuer 25
John Wilson 50

1861 census

Name: John McRewar
Age: 47
Estimated birth year: abt 1814
Relationship: Head
Spouse's name : Agnes
Gender: Male
Where born: Comrie, Perth Sh
Registration Number: 483
Registration district: Kilsyth
Civil parish: Kilsyth
County: Stirlingshire
Address: Drumtrocher
Occupation: Dyke Builder
ED: 12
Household schedule number: 82
Line: 4
Roll: CSSCT1861_64
Household Members:
Name Age
John McRewar 47
Agnes McRewar 47
John McRewar 9
Janet McRewar 7

Glad to have been of help Jim regarding Thomas's birth. Did it by any chance have an RCE on the entry to help you identify his father?

A couple of options for Agnes. You could have a look for a marriage for her sister Mary in the hope that she married after 1855. Kilsyth isn't and wasn't such a big place so the name wouldn't be too common (I hope). Have you looked for a possible death for Agnes or John please? The only problem with that is the many variations in the spelling of their surname.

If you live in Scotland then this is the type of search best undertaken at the Scotlandspeople Centre in person as for the £10 fee for a day's searching would work out much cheaper for you.

Can you narrow the timescale for the deaths of John and Agnes from their children's marriages - although it looks like daughter Agnes may not have married.

Good luck with your research, you sure need it with such a tricky surname.

ann of greengables and rootgatherer thanks for info. i already had those but still no nearer to finding agnes simpson birth. on the 1851 census i think thats her but it has the wrong age for john who was born 1812.unless he forgot his real age.the age of the children are correct . ifound them on IGI and sometimes McRuer is spelled McRuir. Will try scotlands people again on her birth for slamannan.by the way rootgatherer i once asked about a thomas ralston birth 1873 in eastwood parish and you told me to try under mothers maiden name.it was bang on as he was born illegitimate. thanks again

jim

ARCHIBALD MCCRUER Pedigree
Male
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Event(s):
Birth: 07 APR 1847 Kilsyth, Stirling, Scotland
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Parents:
Father: JOHN MCCRUER Family
Mother: AGNES SIMPSON
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Messages:
Extracted birth or christening record for the locality listed in the record. The source records are usually arranged chronologically by the birth or christening date.

1851

Name: Agnes McCrewar
Age: 28
Estimated birth year: abt 1823
Relationship: Wife
Spouse's name: John
Gender: Female
Where born: Slamannan, Stirling
Parish Number: 365
Civil parish: Kilsyth
Town: West Barony
County: Stirlingshire
Address: Drumtocher
ED: 12
Page: 23 (click to see others on page)
Household schedule number: 71
Line: 16
Roll: CSSCT1851_77
Household Members: Name Age
John McCrewar 28
Agnes McCrewar 28
Agnes McCrewar 10
Archd McCrewar 3
Mary Simpson 26 Sister-in-law, b Slammanan
Alexander Frew 16

Source Citation: Parish: Kilsyth; ED: 12; Page: 16; Line: 23; Roll 1074; Year: 1851.

JANET MCCRUER Pedigree
Female
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Event(s):
Birth:
Christening: 18 SEP 1853 Kilsyth, Stirling, Scotland
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Parents:
Father: JOHN MCCRUER Family
Mother: AGNES SIMPSON
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Messages:
Extracted birth or christening record for the locality listed in the record. The source records are usually arranged chronologically by the birth or christening date.

JOHN MCCRUER Pedigree
Male Family
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Parents:
Father: JOHN MCCREWER Family
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Marriages:
Spouse: JANET HUME Family
Marriage: 22 JUN 1759 Drymen, Stirling, Scotland
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Messages:
Extracted marriage record for locality listed in the record. The source records are usually arranged chronologically by the marriage date.

AGNES MCCRUER Pedigree
Female
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Event(s):
Birth: 06 AUG 1840 Kilsyth, Stirling, Scotland
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Parents:
Father: JOHN MCCRUER Family
Mother: AGNES SIMPSON
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Messages:
Extracted birth or christening record for the locality listed in the record. The source records are usually arranged chronologically by the birth or christening date.

Hi I have been trying to find the birth of agnes simpson who married a john mcruer in st ninians stirling on the 31-3-1839.john was born 1812 in comrie perthshire and died in kilsyth 24-1-1868.finding info on agnes is a mystery.I have tried scotlands people and the IGI to no avail.any help from you clever people would be gratefully accepted

many thanks jim