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In the 1851 census Charlotte (nee?) c1815 was married to :-
William Mann c1821 with children William,Charlotte,George,& Emily 0
(who died that year).

In the 1861 census William was married to Mary A (nee ?) c1837 with same children,plus,Richard & Mary.

Did Charlotte die & William re-marry.

Can anyone help me please

Elsa

1851 for ref

1851 England Census
about William Mann
Name: William Mann
Age: 8
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1843
Relation: Son
Father's Name: William Mann
Mother's name: Charlotte Mann
Gender: M (Male)
Where born: St. Georges, Surrey, England

Civil parish: Southwark St George
County/Island: Surrey
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability: View image

Registration district: St George Southwark
Sub-registration district: Borough Road
ED, institution, or vessel: 18
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 194
Piece: 1564
Folio: 481
Page Number: 41
Household Members: Name Age
William Mann 30
Charlotte Mann 36
William Mann 8
Charlotte Mann 5
George Mann 2
Emily Mann 1 Mo
Louisa Pike 22


Andy

Maybe the marriage

London, England, Marriages and Banns, 1754-1921
about William Mann
Name: William Mann
Age: Full Age
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1841
Spouse Name: Charlotte Armstrong
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 19 Jul 1841
Parish: Lambeth St John the Evangelist
Borough: Lambeth
Father Name: William Mann
Spouse Father Name: William Armstrong
Register Type: Parish Register


Andy

1861 census ??

MANN, William Head Married M 40 1821 Cordwainer Rotherhithe, Surrey VIEW
MANN, Mary A Wife Married F 24 1837 St Georges Southwark, Surrey VIEW
MANN, William J Son Unmarried M 18 1843 Cordwainer St Georges Southwark, Surrey VIEW
MANN, Charlotte L Daughter F 15 1846 Boot Binder Lambeth, Surrey VIEW
MANN, George Son M 12 1849 Scholar St Georges Southwark, Surrey VIEW
MANN, Richard A Son M 1 1860 Peckham Camberwell, Surrey VIEW
MANN, Mary A Daughter F 0 (4M) 1861 Camberwell, Surrey VIEW

Piece: 387
Folio: 130
Page: 19
Registration District: Camberwell
Civil Parish: Camberwell
Municipal Borough:
Address: 3, Neate Place, Camberwell
County: London, Surrey

Same district as the 1851 census ??

Deaths Jun 1851 (>99%)
Mann Charlotte St Geo Southk. 4 308
Mann Emily St Geo Southk 4 309

Births Jun 1859 (>99%)
MANN Richard Alexander Camberwell 1d 481

1871 census ??

MANN, William Head M 50 1821 Surrey
MANN, Mary Ann Wife F 34 1837 Surrey
MANN, George Son M 22 1849 Surrey
MANN, Richard Son M 11 1860 Surrey
MANN, Mary Ann Daughter F 9 1862 Surrey
MANN, Eliza Daughter F 7 1864 Surrey
MANN, John Gladstone Son M 4 1867 Surrey
MELLISH, Alfred Lodger M 19 1852 Not Known

Piece: 733
Folio: 104
Page: 6
Registration District: Camberwell
Civil Parish: Camberwell
Municipal Borough:
Address: Meeting House Lane, Camberwell
County: London, Surrey

Thanks Andy.

This seems to be the Charlotte I am looking for.

But she's disappeared from the 1861 census.

And I can't find out anything more about her.

Elsa

I wonder if she died at the same time as Emily - see my post of the two deaths above.

Hi Lynski.

I've researched the two deaths .

Emily Mann is the right one.

But Charlotte Mann's age is aged 0 at death.
I think if all else fails I shall have to apply for this certificate to see if the age is a mistake.

Elsa

Just curious - how do you know that Charlotte's age is 0 at death without ordering the certificate?

Have you found the record somewhere else?

Did you get Charlottes death record from GR? If so, they enter the age at death as 0 if no age is available..........pain in the butt


You would need the death cert to find her age


Heres a link to free BMDs



http://www.freebmd.org.uk/

Lynski I got the death record from G.R

And as Gins said everyone is 0 registered.

Yes Gins it certainly is a ''pain in the Butt''

It costs a lot to research wrong info.

Oh well !!!

Thanks for all your help

Elsa

London, England, Marriages and Banns, 1754-1921
Name: Mary Ann Vidler <<<18 Portland St
Age: 22
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1836
Spouse Name: William John Mann <<<Widower, Cordwainer
Spouse Age: 35
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 7 Jun 1858
Parish: Walworth St Peter
Borough: Southwark
Father Name: Richard Vidler <<Plasterer
Spouse Father Name: William Mann <<<Shipwighr (Deceased)
Register Type: Parish Register

Address: 22 Trafalger St

Wit: Richard ?? & Ann Vidler

I posted the death earlier and there are no age of death listed in 1851.

That's why I was curious as to how it was known to be 0?

When I looked on FreeBMD for Charlotte Mann deaths between 1851 and 1911 the death ages don't start until 1867 for that particular name.

London, England, Births and Baptisms, 1813-1906
Name: William Thomas Man
Record Type: Baptism
Estimated Birth Date: abt 1821
Baptism Date: 18 Feb 1821
Father's Name: William Man <<<Shipwright
Mother's name: Rachel Man
Parish or Poor Law Union: Rotherhithe St Mary
Borough: Southwark
Register Type: Parish Registers

I think this is the same William Mann that married Mary Ann Vidler......seems William changed his middle name a lot. His middle name on his son Richards marriage is Alexander!


The marriage Andy posted has the correct details for this birth and his second marriage that I posted


The entry has his father William Mann Shipwright & Charlottes father: Shoemaker as is William (Groom)

Address: James St

Wit: ? J Armstrong & C Armstrong

London, England, Births and Baptisms, 1813-1906
Name: Charlotte Armstrong
Record Type: Baptism
Estimated Birth Date: abt 1818
Baptism Date: 16 Dec 1818
Father's Name: William Armstrong <<Shoemaker
Mother's name: Eleanor Armstrong
Parish or Poor Law Union: Westminster St Anne Soho
Borough: Westminster <<<<New Street
Register Type: Bishop's Transcript


1841 England Census
Name: Charlotte Armstrong
Age: 20
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1821
Gender: Female

Civil parish: St George The Martyr
Hundred: Southwark
County/Island: Surrey
Country: England

Registration district: St George Southwark
Sub-registration district: Borough Road
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 1084
Book: 1
Folio: 18
Page Number: 28
Household Members: Name Age
William Armstrong 50 <<<Shoemaker
John Armstrong 30
Mary Armstrong 30
Charlotte Armstrong 20
George Armstrong 15

Yes Gins I think that is the same William.

It's a pain researching all our ancesters with the same first names !!!!

And I have surnames in my family tree,which the most common.

Phew.........My brain hurts.

Gratfully Elsa.

1851 England Census
Name: Mary A Vidler
Age: 15
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1836
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Richard Vidler
Mother's name: Ann Vidler
Gender: F (Female)
Where born: Southwark, Surrey, England

Civil parish: Camberwell
Ecclesiastical parish: St George
County/Island: Surrey
Country: England


Registration district: Camberwell
Sub-registration district: St George
ED, institution, or vessel: 17
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 60
Piece: 1582
Page Number: 14
Household Members: Name Age
Richard Vidler 45 <<<<<<<<Plasterer
Ann Vidler 45
Alfred Vidler 17
Mary A Vidler 15
George Vidler 9
Jane Vidler 6
Ann Vidler 2

Hi Gins

I think I am going to get some certificates for William as his middle name keeps changing.

Also there is some confusion with Charlottes date of birth.
ie:- Charlotte baptised 1818.
1841 census she was 20 which makes her birth date 1821.
1851 census she was 36 so born in1815.

The trouble was a lot of people where illiterate,so they weren't sure of date etc.