Find Ancestors

Mygrt grt grandfather is on 1861 census and onwards as being the above. but it states on the birth cert he was born in Cumberland.. Does anyone have a clue as to why this might be.

Hello Diane, if you give us his name and when he was born we can take a look and get a better idea of the circumstances.

Were his parents British?

Were his parents born abroad? It happens the other way round quite a lot. People born abroad to British parents and the census states they are British subjects.

Andy

his name is robert jordan dob 1836, born in cumberland,

dont know parents, cant find him on 1841 census.

Just for background - 1861:


JORDAN, Robert Head Married M 25 1836 Police Constable Naturalized British Subject
JORDAN, Elizabeth Wife Married F 26 1835 Naturalized British Subject
JORDAN, Anthony Son M 5 1856 Naturalized British Subject
JORDAN, William Son Unmarried M 0 (8M) 1861 ... British Subject

Registration District: Birkenhead
Civil Parish: Birkenhead

Address: 25, Somerville Street, Birkenhead County: Cheshire

Diane - you're saying you don't know his parents but that his birth certificate says he was born in Cumberland.

His parents must be named on his birth certificate (or at least the mother).

Do you mean that you've found a birth record in the index for someone of the same name in Cumberland?

Your best bet is to get a copy of his marriage certificate from GRO to confirm his father's name (if he knew him).

This is the right one. Sorry new to this, what is just for background?

You surely cannot have his birth cert if he was born in 1836 ???

They did not exist before 1837 !

Dea x

The 1871 doesn't say he was a British subject??

JORDAN, Robert Head M 35 1836 Cumberland < Manager of public house
JORDAN, Elizebeth Wife F 37 1834 Shropshire
JORDAN, Anthony Son M 15 1856 Cumberland
JORDAN, Henry Son M 4 1867 Cheshire
JORDAN, Emma G Daughter F 0 1871 Cheshire
MEE, William Lodger M 39 1832 Ireland
NEWSHAM, James Servant M 23 1848 Westmorland
RODGERS, Elizebeth Servant F 18 1853 Flintshire

Registration District: Birkenhead
Civil Parish: Birkenhead

Address: Chester Street, Birkenhead County: Cheshire

Robert's birthplace looks like West Linton.

Diane - just for background means I'm posting it to give myself and other helpers a clear picture of the family.

On one of the later censuses it states he was born in cumberland.

On the 1861 the youngest child is stated as being a Naturalized British Subject and 1 month old. Now I think that iit s highly unlikely he had been naturalized within the month of his birth and a return from overseas!

I would say the most likely scenario is that Robert misunderstood/misread the question on the household schedule and answered 'Natural British Subject' and the Enumerator transcribed it into his book as naturalized.

More than willing to be corrected if anyone can think of something more likely :-D

**EDIT** Just noticed the youngest child is 8 months old but I still think the above is the most likely explanation.

Chris

1841 census - could this be Robert Jordan born c1836 Cumberland.

Name: Robert Jordine
[Robert Jordan]
Age: 5
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1836
Gender: Male
Where born: Cumberland, England

Civil parish: Kirk Linton
Hundred: Eskdale
County/Island: Cumberland
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation: View image

Registration district: Longtown
Sub-registration district: Low Longtown
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 169
Book: 13
Folio: 14
Page Number: 23
Household Members: Name Age
Sarah Allen 65
Elizabeth Jordine 25
Robert Jordine 5
William Jordine 2
Margaret Jordine 15

Name: Robt. Jordan
Gender: Male
Baptism/Christening Date: 08 May 1836
Baptism/Christening Place: KIRKLINTON,CUMBERLAND,ENGLAND
Birth Date:
Birthplace:
Death Date:
Name Note:
Race:
Father's Name: James Jordan
Father's Birthplace:
Father's Age:
Mother's Name: Elizth.
Mother's Birthplace:
Mother's Age:
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C05799-1
System Origin: England-ODM
Source Film Number: 90638
Reference Number:

I wouldn't rule out an overseas connection. Is it possible that Robert was born in Cumberland but then went abroad with his family? That may explain why on his first census back in England he used the term British subject.

Can anyone find him in 1841 or 1851?

When/where did he and Elizabeth marry?

A child has the nationality of its father. When a British woman marries a foreigner, back then she acquired the nationality of her husband. I would guess his dad was a foreigner living in Cumberland.

It would seem he applied for, and was granted, British citizenship. I think he could include his wife and kids on the same application, and they'ld all be granted British citizenship as a job lot.

If this happened before mid 1860, the youngest kid would be the son of a British citizen and so automatically a British Subject - if after, he would have been part of the job lot and so a naturalized British Subject.

The 1901 has a very specific birth place for Robert


1901 Census

Name: Robert Jordan
Age: 65
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1836
Relation: Father-in-law
Spouse's Name: Elizabeth Jordan
Gender: Male
Where born: West Linton, Cumberland, England

Civil parish: Birkenhead
Ecclesiastical parish: Tranmere St Catherine
County/Island: Cheshire
Country: England

Registration district: Birkenhead
Sub-registration district: Tranmere

Henry J Swinburne 32 b.ca 1869, Aberswenny, Monmouthshire, Railway Clerk
Emma G Swinburne 30 b.ca 1871, Birkenhead, Cheshire
Robert Jordan 65 Railway Porter
Elizabeth Jordan 66 b.ca 1835, Pontesbury, Shropshire, Mother-in-law

Address:- 28 Seymour St



Marriages Dec 1892 (>99%)

Jordan Emma Gertrude Birkenhead 8a 807
SWINBURNE Henry Jackson Birkenhead 8a 807





I honestly believe that the entry of him being a Naturalized British Subject was an error. Chris' suggestion makes a lot of sense!




sylvia

Possible marriage for Robert Jordan and Elizabeth Thirlwell:

ROBERT JORDEN Male
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Event(s):
Birth:
Christening:
Death:
Burial:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Marriages:
Spouse: ELIZABETH THIRLWALL
Marriage: 28 JAN 1837 Holme Cultram, Cumberland, England

Just to add that there is no Robert Jordan indexed at the NA in Naturalisation case papers (1789-1934)

A search on the surname can be done here...

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/records/looking-for-person/naturalised-britons.htm

Chris