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Hi

I am wondering if anyone can help me in my quest to find James Samways born 1858 Avington, Hampshire after the 1881 Census prior to and including this I have found him living with his family. But from 1891-to 1911 I am unable to find James Samways -I am able to find his wife and children but he is not living with them in any of them.

James Samways was married in 1874 at Litchfield Parish Church to Alice Mary Prince and they had three children together the youngest being my Great Grandfather Archibald James Samways who was born on the 23/02/1888 at Cuttenham, North Newnton, Wiltshire and this birth was registered by his Father in March 1888, a Farm Bailiff after this date I can however not find him.

I contacted the Wiltshire record office and they have informed me that James Samways was first mentioned at Cuttenham in 1891 Eastern/ Devizes Electrol Roll. He is however not on the 1891 cenus at Cuttenham and he is not living with his wife and family whom are living with her parents in Litchfield, Hampshire in 1891 Cenus.

Can anyone please do a search of the Eastern/Devizes Electrol Roll from 1891 -onwards and inform me when he is there till? Can anyone find him? I would be very greatful for all the help and assistance. I know an awful lot about his wife and children but pratically nothing about James -including not being able to find his death.

Thank you in advance and Best Wishes for Christmas

Joanna

Have you checked the Scottish census?


Is Alice shown as married in 1901 and 1911?

Alice is living as a servant showing as married at South Ham Farm, Worting Road, Basingstoke, Hampshire in 1901 Cenus with one of her sons.

Of course dont know have the 1911 cenus to hand but pretty sure she says married again here. I have her death in which it says wife of James Samways Farm Bailiff.

But on Archibald James Samways marriage certificate 08/05/1911 he refers to Father as deceased -but whether that was in his eyes, not physically I dont know.

No had not even thought to look at Scotland -how stupid

Joanna

Still looking for James Samways 1858 but have now located his wife Alice Mary Samways in 1911 cenus -surname incorrectly spelled as TAMWAYS. This is record

BRIGHT, George Head Married
21 years M 55 1856 Farmer Bower Chalke Wilts VIEW
BRIGHT, Ellen Wife Married
21 years F 46 1865 Aldersholt Dorset VIEW
BRIGHT, James Son Single M 18 1893 Farmers Son Working On Farm Salisbury Wilts VIEW
BRIGHT, George Son Single M 17 1894 Farmers Son Working On Farm Salisbury Wilts VIEW
BRIGHT, Jane Mother In Law Widow F 73 1838 Martin Wilts VIEW
TAMWAYS, Alice Mary Servant Married F 46 1865 Mother's Help Stourpaine Dorset VIEW

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RG number:
RG14 Piece:
12092 Reference:
RG14PN12092 RG78PN677 RD253 SD1 ED10 SN19

Registration District:
Salisbury Sub District:
Alderbury Enumeration District:
10 Parish:
Winterslow

Address:
East Winterslow Salisbury County:
Wiltshire


Have been on the Scots people site and no James Sawmays come up in 1891 or 1901 cenus in fact there was only 11 match for samways surname in 1891 and 1901 cenus 18 match's. I dont know whether it is worth paying and viewing this matches at all?


Joanna

Have you discounted this?

Deaths Sep 1913
Samways James H 57 Alverstoke 2b 618

As my James Samways did not have a middle name -dont believe it is likely to be him. There is a James Henry Samways born 1855 in Alverstoke -so am guessing this is his death.

But I dont rule anything out completely as I am at a lost after the most recent info that I have is from 1891 when he was in Eastern/Devizes Electrol Roll in living at Cuttenham, North Newnton, Wiltshire.

Thanks for all suggestions

Joanna

Off to bed will check back tomorrow Thanks Joanna

He's listed as unmarried in 1881:

1881 England Census
about James Samways
Name: James Samways
Age: 22
Estimated birth year: abt 1859
Relation: Son
Mother's name: Mary Samways
Gender: Male
Where born: Avington, Hampshire, England
Civil Parish: Litchfield
County/Island: Hampshire
Country: England
Street address: Down Farm
Employment status: View image
Occupation: Ag Lab Farm Foreman (Bailiff)
Registration district: Kingsclere
Sub-registration district: Highclere
ED, institution, or vessel: 1
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Mary Samways 51
James Samways 22
George Samways 18

Rose

Looks like he married in 1884 whereas your first post says 1874.

Rose

Confirming Rose's statement:

Surname First name(s) District Vol Page
Marriages Mar 1884
PRINCE Alice Mary Kingsclere 2c 327
Samways James Kingsclere 2c 327

Am so sorry a complete slip with the date but of course a very important difference -yes he married 1884.

They had Florence Amy Samways 1884 April-June Litchfield, Hampshire, Ernest Edward Samways 02/03/1886 in Litchfield and my Great Grandfather Archibald James Samways in 23/02/1888 in Cuttenham, North Newnton, Wiltshire

Thanks for all your help and sorry for the mistake in date

Joanna

Seems likely he upped and left Alice but I don't see him under a new surname. Could be he changed his name completely.

Try looking for all males born Avington c1859 in 1901 and 1911 and see who you can't trace back.

Rose

Good idea Rose, had looked at males born Avington, but nothing jumped out, but I will do as you say and try and trace them all and see what I find.

Thanks

Joanna

There was a James Lamkins/Sawkins in 1901 but I was able to trace him back.

Rose

I am looking closely at a James Lawkins/ SAWKINS

I have found the family as SAWKINS in 1891 and 1911 cenus and LAWKINS in 1901 cenus

1891 CENUS
SAWKINS, James Head Married M 33 1858 Gamekeeper
Homington
Hampshire VIEW
SAWKINS, Emma Wife Married F 35 1856
Fonthill Gifford
Wiltshire VIEW
SAWKINS, Alfred G Son M 8 1883 Scholar
Romsey
Hampshire VIEW
SAWKINS, John Son M 7 1884 Scholar
Crowley
Hampshire VIEW
SAWKINS, Mary J Daughter F 5 1886 Scholar
Winchester
Hampshire VIEW
SAWKINS, James Son M 3 1888 Scholar
Froxfield
Hampshire VIEW
SAWKINS, Thomas Son M 2 1889
Dinton
Wiltshire VIEW

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RG number:
RG12 Piece:
1623 Folio:
44 Page:
9

Registration District:
Wilton Sub District:
Bishopstone Enumeration District:
4 Ecclesiastical Parish:
Dinton

Civil Parish:
Dinton Municipal Borough:
Wilton Address:
Salisbury Road, Dinton, Wilton County: Wiltshire

1901 CENUS
LAWKINS, James Head Married M 40 1861 Gamekeeper
Avington
Hampshire VIEW
LAWKINS, Emma Wife Married F 41 1860
Hindon
Wiltshire VIEW
LAWKINS, John Son Single M 18 1883 Gamekeeper
Colmore
Hampshire VIEW
LAWKINS, Tom Son M 13 1888
Hurdcort
Wiltshire VIEW
LAWKINS, Emma Daughter F 3 1898
West Tytherley
Hampshire VIEW

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RG number:
RG13 Piece:
1078 Folio:
36 Page:
5

Registration District:
Stockbridge Sub District:
Broughton Enumeration District:
3 Ecclesiastical Parish:
West Tytherley

Civil Parish:
West Tytherley Municipal Borough:
Address:
Briffs, West Tytherley County:
Hampshire

and 1911 Cenus
SAWKINS, James Head Married M 52 1859 Gamekeeper Havington Hants VIEW
SAWKINS, Emma Wife Married
29 years F 54 1857 Fonthill Wilts VIEW
SAWKINS, Emma Daughter F 12 1899 School West Tytherley Hants VIEW

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RG number:
RG14 Piece:
7619 Reference:
RG14PN7619 RG78PN373 RD137 SD1 ED5 SN101

Registration District:
Hertford Sub District:
Watton Enumeration District:
5 Parish:
Walkern

Address:
Box Wood Cottage Walkern County:
Hertfordshire

Not found James Sawkins in 1881 cenus -and of course dont know the maiden name of wife Emma. According to 1911 cenus they have been married 29 years by then and had 6 children, 1 whom has died. So marriage should be around 1882? Not found it yet

Could this be my James Samways -Sawkins very similar?

Did he have two families?

Many Thanks for everyone's help -unlikely will get on Computer much before 27th but will check thread as soon as possible

Thanks again everyone

Joanna

Rose

Could you point me to the 1881 cenus etc as could not find it?

Joanna

Still trying to trace this James Sawkins back through census -tried to find marriage. But in 1911 cenus -said they had been married 29 years -this would lead to a marriage in 1881/1882 -there is no marriages for a James Sawkins between 1879 -1889?

Now I have found a James Sawkins born Alresford District, Hampshire Jan-March 1859 -so this could be the James Sawkins in 1891/1901 and 1911 cenus -but can not seem to find James Samkins born Hampshire in 1861/1871 and 1881 cenus?

Any help greatfully received
Joanna

Hi Joanna,

I found James Sawkins in 1891 and saw his first child was born 1892 so assumed he wasn't your James. However, you're correct. I can find no sign of him before this.

Rose

Rose

Yeah I saw his first child was 1882 and thought this does not make sense -but the reason I had not discounted completely was because his children were born Hampshire -except 1 Thomas born 1889 in Wiltshire and James Samways first two children with Alice Mary were born in Hampshire and his third Archibald James Samways born 1888 in Wiltshire? -Similarities I thought but of course could be wild goose chase, but nothing more concrete to follow.

Thank you Rose for you help


Joanna

Just trying to compare the signature on marriage certificate to Alice Mary Samways to the entry on 1911 cenus -I beleive the James looks similar but as no writing expert, could be just as I want it to.

Gonna continue this mystery tomorrow -good night and thanks

Joanna